The Pavilion Podcast
The Pavilion Podcast

Episode · 3 months ago

Ep 116: The Best Way To Train and Enable Your Sales Team w/ Maria Bross

ABOUT THIS EPISODE

Ep 116: The Best Way To Train and Enable Your Sales Team w/ Maria Bross 

Part of the TGIM (Thank God It's Monday) series hosted by Tom Alaimo.  

All right, thank God it's monday.Welcome back to the Pavilion podcast. This is your host, Tom Alamo. This iswhere revenue leaders come to learn the tips, the tricks, the tactics that theyneed to be successful in their roles. Super excited for this episode withMaria bras as our guest a little bit about Maria. She's down in charlestonsouth Carolina sales manager for north America at Rock Content. She's also athree time linked in top 100 sales star. She's the sc raw powerlifting recordholder. She's a mama to be a self proclaimed seeker of truth. A friend ofmine and is someone that's super passionate about enablement andtraining and development of salespeople Before her time at Rock Content, shewas running enablement over at Boom town has held several egg rolls bin inthe space for just about a decade. So we talked a ton about her switch from Eto enablement to sales manager, getting back in the quota chair, how she'straining and developing her reps, some latest trends you see and I think it'sreally going to enjoy this episode before we get to that. Let's give aquick shout out to our sponsor. This episode is brought to you by drift.More than 50,000 businesses use drift to grow revenue and increase customerlifetime value faster drift, helps their customers alliance sales andmarketing on a single platform to deliver a unified customer experiencewhere people are free to have a conversation with the business at anytime on their terms, learn more at dot com. You can also find more about me.I'm tom Alamo, I work over at going, you can add me on linked in otherwise,feel free to give this podcast subscribe on Apple or Spotify orwherever you're listening. Without further ado, let's get into myconversation with Maria, the boss ross. Alright, Maria, good morning. Welcometo the Pavilion podcast. How are you? Good morning. Good early morning to youtom I know we're just watching the sunrise here up up through my window.What's shaking? Where are you right now in the world? I'm in charleston southCarolina. Okay, nice. That's home base for you, isn't it? Okay, nice. We'reexcited to have you on and congrats on the somewhat recent role heading overto rock content. Yes, sir, I'm excited. So, you know, one thing I wanted totalk to you about, we had talked in the past on on my other podcast about yourpath from a rock star A. E. And then getting into the world of enablementand you've gone over back to the dark side of the quota world. So I'd love tohear you just talk a little bit about the transition one for people that aremaybe aren't as familiar with you of of 82 enablement. And then going back intothe world of now in sales management and working on, you know, more of likethe quota side, uh, and the deal side...

...of the business versus just like thetraining side. Yeah. So, um, I spent seven years in outbound sellingprospecting roles for BTB tech companies and learned a lot, reallystruggled as a ref. Like I'm very transparent with my team now that I'vebeen on a pit before, I've, I've really struggled myself so I know what it'slike, you know how difficult it can be in a sales role that, you know, that'swhy we can make so much money in sales because it really is so hard. So I didthat for a long time and learned a lot. I went on that pitch, but I wasmentioned earlier and I was able to learn a lot from that experience and Irealized, hey, I can learn to be good at sales. I'm not seeking feedback, I'mnot seeking to learn and grow my skills and that practicing outside of work.And this is really why I'm feeling so um, I started investing a lot of timeinto just like my education of sales and networking, reaching out to peopletrying to learn from others, listening to podcasts, reading more and mycommission checks reflected that. And I got to feel a lot more confident on thephone and like I was delivering a lot more value and really fell in love withsales in the process. And because of that, because I needed all thisguidance and I wasn't naturally good at sales. I built a lot of like salesenablement materials at the time, I didn't realize like that's what it wasthat I was building, but when there was a sales enablement roll open, I was oneof the people that my company at the time talked to and was like, hey, haveyou thought about a career in sales enablement before? And I was likebefore this company, I didn't even know what sales enablement was like, no, Ihaven't thought of it, I've always wanted to be a sales manager andthey're like, well this could be a good stuff in that direction, just to takeon more of a coaching role, training role, but you can spend a lot of timecreating those documents that you're creating for your team right now, umand actually get paid for it without a quota. And I was like, that soundspretty interesting. So I went into sales people well, I first started outin one of like a communications sales enablement role, where I was doing someof the training and onboarding, but my primary focus was really like going todifferent departmental meetings, let's say with product or with the supportteam or CS, and seeing like any changes that were happening in theirdepartments would affect sales, like, for example, if there was a new releasecoming out in product without impact sales is demos, so I was really thatliaison between those different departments and don't have tocommunicate that and train them if there was like, a big change happening.So that was a really great education into like what different departments do,how they interact, how different pieces of the business impact each other andreally loved it. And then in my most recent role at Boom town, I started thesales enablement program from the ground up, and that was a big learningexperience for me, I mean and probably the best opportunity of my career. Ireally learned so much in that role,...

...had incredible leadership and a lot ofcreative freedom to just take it and build what I wanted to build from it.So really just kind of like a unicorn situation and yeah, and really fell onthe team, built the onboarding program from the ground up and did a lot ofcoaching of the reps, worked with the sales leadership team very, veryclosely and love that there. I was able to grow a lot in those two years, learna lot from sales leaders there and also just being kind of thrown into theposition and being like, wow, I don't know what I'm doing, I need to reachout to other people and Watch videos like 7th actors videos and sales hood,for example, were so huge for me then and I just binge watched all of thoseand, and started built out the program based on her expertise and what shethinks that how you should build a sales enablement program. It worked outreally well. The team did Over 100% of gold during the pandemic that year, soit was incredible. I saw a lot of growth and then I started to get in theposition, It definitely wasn't boring. I just definitely didn't not feelchallenged because I was, it was more so that I would get so attached to thesales reps and onboarding and training and it felt like I had to give them upto their sales management to continue on and I didn't want to. And so it wasalmost like that feeling when you move from being a BDR and you're ready tobecome an E. Where it's like you've developed this relationship, you'vedelivered value, you want to help this, this potential client and then it'slike okay cool. Here a here's this great opportunity now you go close itand it sort of felt like that sort of hand off from sales training to theirsales manager. So I got more interested again into going into sales managementand this opportunity with rob came up and it was it was a really awesomeopportunity again to build something from the ground up like I did at boomtown but from a sales management perspective nothing really was definedyet. For the U. S. Sales team, the Brazilian sales team has been likenumber one brand, lots of brand recognition and huge clients, theirstudents super well but our U. S. Market just started in january so umreally just building that, building up the team hiring and starting out theoutbound processes there. So it's been a journey, it's really challenging,it's really exciting and again like being thrown into this like that'ssomething I'm learning on my feet and trying to reach out to others and so toprocess that makes it a well oiled machine so that you know, we can reallygrow from there. Yeah, so it sounds like in your last two roles, you reallykind of taken it 0-1, 1st on the enablement side and then now on like anoutbound sales motion. So I'd love to talk about both those experiences foranyone that might be wanting to or currently in that same process oftrying to build from the ground up. So...

I'm curious like okay you go into aboom town and you are trying to build out their enablement, you know, wholeorgans and structure. Like you said, you just binge watched videos andyou're trying to educate yourself. Like, what were the first steps that you took,like? Because when I think about enablement, there's so many things thatit could look like, right, it could be like, content for the A. S, it could belike, how do you onboard wraps? It could be, I don't know, like, scriptsfor, you know, Sdrs, like, where do you start? And maybe it's none of thosethree things that I just made those up on the spot. No, it is. I mean, you'recompletely right. I did all of those things at boom town and it was so funto do, but you're right in the fact that prioritization is really thechallenge because there's so many cool exciting things you do you can do,especially brand new sales enablement, like, whatever you do, it's going tomake an impact from having nothing to having something. So that's what I hadto like have peace with myself that night at the end of the day that it'slike, okay, I'm trying to prioritize these things, but whatever I do isgoing to be better than nothing and we're going to see results from it. Sothat was good to know going into it. But really the first thing that I did,and the first thing I'm doing now is a sales manager is almost for lack ofbetter terms and audit. So a lot of observing, a lot of listening to calls,lot of getting to know the different departments and seeing where there'sgaps. So, you know, that's the biggest thing, especially from sales enablement.They had a pretty sophisticated sales organization at boom town where theyhad processes built out, they had a really great leadership team, they hadreps that had been in the role for years. So there was a lot of areas forme to observe and to learn from them and to interview the reps, interviewthe leadership, interview the leaders from other teams to see where I canmake the biggest impact first. So I really just made like a list of thosedifferent areas and and sort of waited weighed them out based on what would bemake the biggest impact. And for us specifically, it was the onboardingprogram because they were basically doubling their sales team within thatyear. So it was like, wow, we really have to get standardization across theboard and what training looks like if we're really going to set these wrapsup for success. So that's where I spent the majority of my time is really um,documenting tribal knowledge, building out the content for onboarding fortraining and testing things to see if it works. I mean, I made lots ofadjustments. I trained 42 reps in the pandemic, so that was just like thevirtual part of the year and then I trained probably a similar number ofreps prior to that. So there was lots of iterations, almost, it's definitelyevery month, sometimes more frequently than that, that I was on boarding newreps and it was awesome to have the...

...support of the sales managers and theywould help me as well and sometimes no more of the tenure wraps and the teamwould come in and lead sessions to which I was really grateful for. Butyeah, just like you learn a lot from the different iterations of thetrainings, Like for example, one of the biggest ones was when I first startedout I would do the training and it would be okay, this is all about thecompany, this is all about the product, these are the people that we sell tothis the day in the life. And then I realized, and you know when we do thecool car role plays, when we would talk like it would be very product focus incold calls and I was like, ooh, before we talk about products, let me sort ofswitch these things around a little bit and now we spend like the first four orfive days just on buyer personas, the jobs to be done by the people weretalking to really getting in the head of what are the challenges? What arethe goals of our prospects? What makes them successful? What are they doing ifthey don't have our solution really those, those areas that we could getinto the head of our prospects. And then we talked about, okay, now, wheredo we fit into that? How do we make their lives better their jobs easierthan more successful? And the dots just clicked a lot better and then we woulddo role plays and then they would have like very like a lot more organicconversations on the phone in connect calls, because they had a goodunderstanding of the process prior to picking up the phone and like thequestions were better just because they had that solid foundationalunderstanding of what their life looked like. How important was it as anenablement leader to, you mentioned this for a second earlier, but like thealignment that you had with the other sales leaders, right? And making surethat one of the things that you're teaching are aligned with, like whatthey're looking for and vice versa, that you're on the same page for what agood rep looks like at a certain stage in their training and development. Andthen obviously at some point you're, it was a hard thing for you, but you haveto pass them off to their manager and like their development then rest ontheir managers shoulders. But could you speak a little bit too what thatrelationship looks like, That is huge. And probably like looking back, thatwas the biggest mistake I made early on in that role, is thinking, oh, I can dothis. I know I can look at the data until where deals are getting stuck inthe pipeline. So, you know, if they're getting stuck in the discovery phase,then I can listen to a bunch of discovery calls and myself determinewhat's going wrong and do trainings around that for the team or just tryingto do it all on my own. And that's what I tried to do at first, not so muchbecause I thought I knew more than them, but more. So I didn't want to take themaway from their team and I had something to prove. I wanted to provethat, hey, I can do this, I'm gonna do a great job and I can do it by myselfand that was the wrong attitude to have.

And I ended up being a lot moresuccessful once that sort of clicked and I was like, man, I really needtheir support. I need to make sure that the trainings that were doing withtheir team are aligned with their goals and that are gonna be the mostimpactful because any time you take a sales rep and I'm talking about likeexisting sales reps now on their team because we would do team trainings toon a quarterly basis and certifications and stuff. So for me, like if I'mtaking them off the sales for selling and taking their valuable time, I wantto ensure that it's going to make a big impact, that it's a good use of theirtime. So getting that commitment with the sales managers on the topics andthe ideas and things that would be most valuable to them was crucial andensuring that they are on board. So we created almost like a like an eventcalendar of trainings in advance and I would run the content by the salesmanager to make sure that like we were an alignment on the strategies andapproaches that we were teaching the reps so that they didn't get one pieceof, you know, one idea when approached from me and then they get coached acompletely different way and confuse them because there's a lot of differentthings in sales, like, as you know, tom like that could be, there's lots ofdifferent opinions on and people disagree. And one way is notnecessarily better than the other, but it was really important. I found for meand their sales leader to be aligned on, okay, well, what's our a protest intown versus, well, this is Maria's approach and this is my manager'sapproach and now I don't know which one is better, which one I should do. Sothat was probably the most important thing. And if I were to go back, Iwould have spent a lot more time in the beginning getting to know them in theirexpectations and getting on like a regular cadence. Um, okay, How do wetrain these reps? One other big thing that we did to, for example, was createscorecards for our role plays and our certifications that not only I used intraining, but that they could use in their one on one sessions when theywere coaching calls. So when I was delivering feedback in training andonboarding, it was be aligned completely with what the manager wasgiving feedback on. So it was the same sort of sorts for cards. And I builtthose with the sales manager. So it wasn't just like my ideas of how itcalls should be scored. It was the collective team. And did you just had acuriosity, did you do that through any technology or is just like on a googlesheet or how did you do the scorecards? Yeah, I'm, I'm super old school at thattime. We um, you know, I did print out pieces of paper when we were in personand I would literally just be filling them out and that's probably not thebest way to do them. But yeah, we're super old school and then I think we,we got a little bit more Tuckey when the pandemic happened and we'reonboarding people virtually, we moved...

...to google drive. You will die. Yeah,cutting edge, cutting edge. And now in the world of sales management, you weresaying before we started that the team had just kind of split up tospecialists, you know, partially an inbound, partially an outbound, youjumped at the opportunity of outbound. I'd love to hear you talk about why youprefer outbound and again, you know how you're starting to build that from theground up for the US market, sure you really want to get me on my soapbox nowbecause I love out. But I, you know, I tried to give that sort of passion andpassed down that love and passion for Alfa found onto my team because to behonest, I don't think a lot of them have been exposed solely to outbound.Like I spent two years as a pr just outbound styling and prospecting andlinked in messaging and stuff and I fell in love with the suck of it all.You know, it takes like a very interesting like glutton for pain typeof sales reps able to take that every day. No, but in all seriousness though,I jumped at the chance of outbound because I think there's so muchopportunity in that and for me it's a control thing, whereas I don't want tonecessarily, and we have a great marketing team whose incredible andthey're delivering over goal of mpls and inbound leads and so they'reawesome. But for me, like I want to go after I want to be able to targetaccounts that reach like that are the I. C. P. Target personas. Do the research,find the people that were going to be able to help the most versus rely onjust whoever is coming in and bound. And so that's always been exciting tome and it's also lead to bigger deals because you know, it's you know, moretargeted and who again we can who's a better fit necessarily. And also I hateour PS and being in super competitive R. P. S where like you don't know, okay,well this competitor, they really source the opportunity and you're justgetting this RFP because they need a third quote for this. And so that'salways really turned me off on inbound. I like the idea of being able toeliminate a potential challenge and start going the relationship eventhough it is probably a longer sales process, but get in on that groundfloor and start building that relationship and then when it is timeto get the deal done, they must always go with you because you're the one thateducated them on the problem and was there throughout it all. Yeah, there's,I mean I haven't done an RFP in a little while, but that was probably myleast favorite part of sales and to your point that they always seem likethey're constructed for someone. It's usually not you somehow you never havethe one that's like perfectly for you and I much prefer the other way. So I'mdefinitely with you on that. I feel...

...like the hardest part of outbound isthat right? It's that you have to educate people, but it's also a timingthing, right? Like you could find the right person that would be the perfectsolution for you. But maybe they're just whether it's budgetary or for someother reason there's a major project, like it just might not be the righttime. I'm curious do you have any like triggers that you coach on for liketrying to find people in the right time? Because I always find from outboundfinding the titles using sales and things like that. You can get contactinfo on zoom in for something like that. But finding the right timing, I feellike it's always been the hardest part. Yeah, I'm with you and I know thatthere are, there's stuff that you can use. Like I'm aware of six cents and Ithink there's a few others out there that can help with like intent data andI know that that would be super powerful just to get aligned on timing.But for me I haven't really, I haven't really gone there yet. Maybe in thefuture, but right now I'm more more focused on one trigger to that we useis job openings. So I'll look for if I'm like researching a target account,I'll look to see if they're hiring like we sell to marketing team. So I love tosee if they're growing in their marketing department. I've looked onsales Navigator and their insights tab and you can see as a company, Have theygrown employee count and then also depart mentally. So again we sell themarketing. So I looked up the marketing department and you can see over thelast 36 12 months, what percentage has that team grown? And if you can see, Ohwow, like they've grown their marketing team 50% this year. That's a trigger ofwhile they're investing in that area. So I wonder if there's a there'sprobably a reason behind that and I want to know what it is. It will helpto. So I think that's one good like free trigger almost to look up. Arethey hiring, are they seeing growth? And then another thing too is in ourreports. So I'll control at that. Look look up their annual reports, see iflike their Ceo is talking anything about girls and their sales ormarketing department. And so like that's that's a huge piece of it andalso helps n tailoring your message to, you know what their leadership team issaying internally there, you're going to be more likely to reach out andrespond back to you. Another thing too that we've been doing not necessarilyfrom a timing perspective, but just for a targeting and telling your messageway is is looking at case studies. So we integrate with a few different typesof marketing platforms and usually they're investing in those tools,they're probably a good fit for us to, or at least someone we want to talk to.So I've been pulling up those companies and looking at their case studies andmy team is divided by territory like in industries. So for example, I have tworeps in higher ed. So I would look for those, those success stories in highered for those marketing companies and...

...like this is our target list. And a lotof times they talk about their goals and what they're looking to accomplishthe results, obviously how a case study is structured and that's really helpfulinformation to have going into a call too. So you're someone that I thinkalways has kind of like they're, you know, they're here on the ground, right?You've got the pulse of like what's going on in, in sales and just in termsof whether it might be tech or whether it might be just like new tactics,think think that people are trying or you know what, what some of the thoughtleaders are saying and I just feel like you're always involved in thoseconversations. I'm curious if there's anything that you've tried recently orthat you've learned recently. Again, it could be a technology, it could be anopener to a cold call. It could be really anything. But I'm just curiousif there's anything that's new that you've tried and either succeeded orfailed out. Oh, thank you. Tom that's so kind to say. I mean, I try to be apart of these conversations I try to learn from from folks because we allknow too, like maybe adapting and evolving to like what's the latest andnot let our sales tactics to get dusty. That's probably probably my biggestfear. So one thing that I'm doing with my team especially is just ensuringthat hey, I expect you to fail, I expect you to have some really awfulhold dials and like I will never be upset about it if you're testing outsomething new and we can learn from it as a team. So I think that's number onething that I'm trying to instill with my team, especially as we grow outbound.We're trying to find what works and like testing my assumptions as well. SoI have this team that, that's really pretty awesome in that they'll disagreewith me. I'll be like Maria that that assumption is bogus. Like we can't like,let's test out this way and I'll be like great semi some call recordingsthat go that way, prove me wrong. Like that's that's totally cool. And Ialways try to look back again at the data, like going data, gone labs hasbeen awesome for that. And so that's what I go by but not necessarily likemy pride of what I think was right when I, you know, made a whole bunch of coldcalls three years ago. So I think just starting there, I think that's numberone and then number two, yeah, I try to keep up with josh on for example, I'mmight be his biggest band. He's probably great area back up a littlebit. But I really love what he preaches and I think that you know what he hispost every day like I sent to my team and like, oh man, let's try this. SoI'm also getting back a little bit too some of becoming a curious but withcold calling with some of this stuff because now that I'm getting more Cocosas a sales leader, I'm starting to feel like, wow, this sounds super gimmicky.And that's also challenged a lot of my assumptions from the past as wellbecause I think especially like you tom and need like calling into salesmarketing leaders, they're getting a million of these calls and they'reteaching their teams how to cold call and messaging and stuff. And so likethe, you know, do you have the, can I...

...still 30 seconds to tell you why Icalled, you can hang up, this is a cold call, whatever that line is. I get thatevery every person that cold calls me now and it's just like, okay, I knowwhat you're going to say next because I teach my reps to do this too. And somaybe we should go back to the drawing board and let's try to have like anorganic conversation versus trying out these like gimmicky little tactics. Butagain, I do it myself, so I'm not in a place to judge, but but yeah, I try tobe in the forefront of that, but I think you can get too wrapped up insome of those areas. And I think in the past maybe I have so I think it'salways going to be testing, trying new things, challenging your ownassumptions, challenging your teammates assumptions and testing things out. AndI think that's the biggest thing overall when someone cold calls you, doyou have the initial instinct to like coach them on it or you actually likelistening and maybe considering whether or not you might want to purchase whatthey're buying. I feel like it's probably the former tom I feel so badand I always take them too because it's just good like market research for me.I'm not in a position to buy anything. Like I have zero budget. I mean ifthere's something really powerful that we need, like I could probably bring inmy sorrow and be like, hey, this is something that looks really interesting.You should take a look, but not something that's in my job descriptionis to evaluate tools and don't have budget or any sort of power to do that.But, but I still always listen to the cold calls and if it is someone that'sreally good, that's done that research and has a tailor cold call. Like I'mhappy to introduce them to people that do have a lot more buying power than Ido. But yeah, I've said and I feel so bad. I've sent so many people feedbackfrom Lincoln messages to quote calls, especially to quote emails beforebecause I want them to get better. And I've been that route before two. I'vemade all the mistakes as a sales rep and I've been in a position to where Ihaven't gotten coaching and I've been like, this is okay for me to send thisemail and it's really not okay. But no one told me that it wasn't. So I try tolike deliver that feedback when I have time when I can lightly and and to tryto make them better because if they're part of my sales community to, I wantus to get better as a profession. So I try if I have time to give feedback,but it's probably annoying for them. No, I think if anything, it's encouraged,it breaks up like all of the, there's so much fear that can go into a coldcall and might be anxious and might be dreading it and all that stuff. So ifanyone, you know obviously that the ideal is you set a meeting or you know,get the next step book. But I think the next best cases like someone is atleast nice to you and maybe they offer you a tip or something like that. Likeif I was cold calling, I would, I would take that all day long. So I figuredthat would be something that you, that you would do. Yeah, there is actuallyan SDR who was, I was so impressed by from another tech company. She messagedme on linkedin and to be honest on it,...

...what I won't say the name of thecompany, but it wasn't a great message. It was very, probably focused. It wasvery much like, hey, are you looking for a tool like this? This is what wedo every day back. And I'm like, no, we're good. We have to have, you know,this toll. And she responded right away and she was like, hey, I knew it. This,I'm an SDR, I just started like a few months ago and new to sales. Like, whatfeedback would you give me? And I wrote paragraphs and like I'm here if youneed me, it's like you want to talk through this more if you want a roleplay. And I've had conversations with her now and so like, I love that. Imean that's, that's super fulfilling to me and someone, I was just reallyimpressed by her asking for feedback afterwards when her messaging didn'tland and hopefully obviously she didn't get a sale with me, but hopefully shegot something that's more valuable and in the future her messaging willresonate a lot better with her prospects. Wow, I love that move, lovethat movie. All right. I got two more questions for you before we head off.So first of all, obviously we're on the Pavilion podcast. Um, and so I alwayslike to ask folks whether it's within that this community or just In general,like what is your number one networking tip professionally? It's a goodquestion. Tom networking tips. I think, you know, we go into it and I wasguilty of this too. And I'm actually teaching like a sales navigator classes.We just got it for my whole team this week. I think it salespeople with thepressure of quotas and things like that. We can go into networking with thewrong intentions with like we're going to hit my number, I got to makesomething now of this relationship. And so that's, that's what I would say ismy biggest tip is to go into any of these connections. Like you're meetingsomeone at the bar that's like a friend of a friend, like you wouldn't directlyask them to buy whatever software, bet you have more to take a meeting withyou or to get coffee with you in your first a couple of seconds, meeting themright, That will never happen. So I think my biggest networking tip wouldbe to treat our like internet interactions like we would have inperson to try to just make a lot more organic think about long term likerelationship of like how can I genuinely help this person versus howcan they help me or how can, who can they introduced me to? And that's whatI would say. And I think at the end of the day, you'll get a lot more inreturn out of it by approaching all of your relationships and that sort of wayversus how can they help me? Couldn't agree more. My last question for you,who in the Pavilion Network should be coming on this podcast next? So manypeople? I could go, I would say, and you're a hoe that she was a mentor ofmine or is a mentor of mine and she's...

...doing some really interesting things.She just started her own podcast as well. And she taught me so much, notonly about sales enablement, but about how to be a leader, and how to almostthink of how to prepare for a meeting. Or she helped look over my businessreview when I got the job at Rock content and she helped me prepare anddid it all behind the scenes. She got no or your athletes or anything onlinkedin. I think I wrote like I told her thank you on linkedin publicly, butshe didn't really get anything from it, the better event from the goodness ofher heart. But she is an incredible leader and leads by example. So I thinkthat that would be a, a great person to talk to and what, what's her podcastcalled? I forget off the top of my head. She just tell people to find it. Yeah,but she is awesome and she's a great leader and everyone, including myselfhas a lot to work with her. Awesome. Well, she'll be coming on, Maria, Mariaross, the boss. I always appreciate you sharing your wisdom and your thoughts.What would be the best place for people to reach out if they want to learn from,you connect with you try to sell to you whatever, whatever it might be sure.Message me on linkedin, I connect with literally everyone that sends me arequest. I love having conversations and learning from the sales community,whether you're an SDR, your rep, your manager, I have something to learn fromall of you. So I would love to connect and certain conversations also hiringfrom my sales team. So if you're big on the outbound side, I would love to havea conversation with you and and see if you can be thought and successful atconstant awesome. Great, thanks so much for coming on Maria. Thanks Tom Iappreciate it. All right, Thanks for checking out that episode. This wasbrought to you by drift, the new way businesses by from businesses. You canlearn more and get the conversation started at drift dot com. I'll be backnext week until then, get after it. Have fun again. Hit me up on linkedin.My name is Tom Alamo and work over at dawn until next monday. Get after apiece. Say something. Mhm.

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