The Pavilion Podcast
The Pavilion Podcast

Episode · 2 months ago

Ep 139: Surrendering the Outcome w/ Jacob Warwick

ABOUT THIS EPISODE

Ep 139: Surrendering the Outcome w/ Jacob Warwick

Part of the "Is This A Good Time?" series hosted by Brandon Barton.

Hello everyone and welcome back to thePavilion podcast. I'm your host, Brandon martin, you're listening to Isthis a good time the show where I asked Pavilion members some questions theyanswer. It's a lot of fun. We really shows on Tuesdays and Thursdays hitsubscribe. So you do not miss hearing from our experts and we certainly haveone today. Jacob Warwick is with me, he is the Chief Growth Officer Advisor andhe is a leadership expert. We talk about surrendering the outcome. It'sreally cool tidbits in here. I can't wait for you to listen to. This episodewas brought to you by insight square advanced revenue analytics andforecasting for today's B two B organizations. Your revenue team wakesup every day with questions insight square, it gives you the data drivenanswers in real time. Get 350 out of the box reports and dashboards cellservice. No coat. All right, let's do this episode 64 Is this a good time?Alright, I am here with Jacob Warwick, he is the Chief Growth Officer Advisor.Jacob so great to have you on the pod. Brandon happy to be here. Thanks man.Well look, I'll meet no fellow, we jump right in with the questions. Give usyour current role. Tell us about what you do and how you got here yourbackground. Yeah. So currently I'm the Chief growth officer Advisor, which isa fancy fancy title for saying you do everything but leading engineering team,it's a little bit of a mix between product as well as growth salesmarketing, customer success revenue type things a little bit easier whenthe team size relatively small but eventually we'll scale out to be a muchlarger role essentially we're helping product managers work with their geardata better and providing them a more flexible stimulus spreadsheet typeexperience and I mentioned I'm still working on my elevator pitch there andpart of the challenge in this role is to build out the messaging and coreconcepts of that from the very get go where a series heading into series A sothat's about how early were at there. I...

...got this role have been a founder of myown company in the past, discovered podium for about three years beforethat held multiple executive marketing positions in Silicon Valley, somenotables at buddy schedule. Oh, clear voice and so on. And let's go back tosome of the earlier stuff. I mean you were you've been an adviser in a lot ofdifferent ways which I love. I think this is just a product of being inSilicon Valley and being smart. Probably right like you get asked, canyou come advise this and that. I mean you have listed things like advisor tounder armour and Uber and so forth. Talk a little bit about that in your,you know, not too distant past here. Yeah, a lot of it started as contractroles here and there. You always sometimes take on side hustles or sideroles to ensure your longevity and financial independence while working inSilicon Valley marketing is often last a higher first to fire. So you want toprotect yourselves particularly in a startup environment where you're notentirely sure whether the startup will be successful or not. Certainly been apart of several that were on rocky terrain that have gone through bigtransitions and when you live in a place that's as expensive as SiliconValley, you need to protect yourself. So I started doing some moonlightingvery early in my career and a lot of freelance writing and that got me intomeet some great people and companies that I probably had no business workingat. I got into under armour by starting a health blog writing series with myfitness pal and my fitness pal was acquired into under armour. And when Istarted doing some, my first contracts, my very first kind of vendorrelationship was with under armour, which is a pretty cool first check tohave pin type and that's how some of those things started. Same with Uber. Igot in with Uber with their content marketing team and started developingcontent for them and then working on some of the content strategy for asmaller division within Uber. So a lot of fun stuff that kind of stemmed fromthat. Would you suggest this to kind of...

...young marketers listening, would yousay, hey, get out there and do you have a side hustle? If you will takesomething you're passionate about start writing about it. Have a blog, have a,have a newsletter, get a sub stack any of those things. Is that somethingyou'd suggest? Probably not detective, I guess the older and more experiencedI get, the more I value doing a little bit less and trying to get some of thatmental clarity back to spend more time with family, be more present in the nowkind of thing versus my early twenties and mid twenties was just all hustleall the time to make a name for myself. Sure it's been, it's been very valuableand accelerating my career trajectory and my knowledge and, and having thatmentality of always learning. But at the same time I sacrificed on a lot ofthings in my early twenties that I probably should have taking advantageof? So let me put you on the spot. Let me put, yeah, well let me put you onthe spot. What is the right balance and what, what, what advice would you give?Somebody? You know, early twenties has a good job, how, you know, this issomething that I toy with as well. We're probably around the same age and,and it was just a bunch of putting 100 hour weeks and hustle your ass off inyour twenties so that you had, you know, okay, in successful thirties and nowI'm in my forties, right? The question is, what is the advice you give toyoung people today that that doesn't stick to that hustle culture bullshit?Well, it's really about, you know, that that weird saying that everyone saysit's always nice to have, they say, you know, if you, if you work doingsomething that you love, you'll never work a day in your life and every timeyou say that you're like, okay, but in the real world, is that really bullshit,right? Because how many people can stand up marketing a spreadsheet andsay, I just absolutely care and I'm passionate about spreadsheets and theybuild their career on that. And to some extent, I've done that too. There areother elements that you need to cling to that can both afford your lifestylelifestyle that you're trying to create...

...as well as drive some of the thingsthat you're passionate about, so in some cases you will be more passionateabout the team that you develop in the report you build with others. Andthat's something that I've really found is I enjoy the relationships of workingthrough through Silicon Valley, mostly a relationship based business. I get alittle lost in the heavy administrative things or the really nitty grittymarketing tactical things start to turn me off a little bit. So my advice is tofind something that you truly enjoy spending time with and of course thisis much easier said than done and then you can choose to double down on thatbecause sometimes you get heads down in some work in six hours goes by and youdon't even recognize it's just a blink of an eye. Then other things you'll,you'll start to work on a project that you're a little uneasy about And itwill feel like it's been six hours and you look, and it's been 10 minutes, youhave a deadline and it feels like it's either time is moving exceptionallyslow or it's just eating at you in some way. So you don't want to grind for thesake of grind or hustle for the sake of hustling. You want to you really wantto spend that time doing something that's going to provide something moremeaningful in your life. And that's again, it's it's much easier said thandone because that individual nuances different for the individual themselves.Yeah, for sure. For sure. I like that. Well look, we talk a lot about, youknow, people getting places because of both hard work and luck. Do you have astory of either that kind of from your past and you want to share about, youknow, propelling your career forward. You kind of talked a little bit aboutthe hard work side and having multiple side hustles and advisory stuff. Butyeah, there were a couple of things that somewhere luck, somewhere hardwork kind of combined. I entered the space, having not gone to college and Ijust happened to graduate high school, right? When the economy took its mostrecent collapse. like this was back in 2000 and eight and you could eithertake that as well. That's unfortunate you're entering the job market at theworst time ever and you don't have a college education, good luck kid or youcan take it like I did which there was...

...a lot of mid and senior level folks whoare out of work That that job still needed to get done and I was there atthe right time to be able to pick up some of those skills and take jobs thatI had no business in getting at a very early age. I built a custom crm at 18,I didn't even know that they were called crm at the time we were buildingsoho campaigns and sales enablement marketing automation at 8 50 an hourjust doing stuff like that, which most people would scoff at like you can't dothat for $8 an hour and that's ridiculous. I didn't know any better, Ijust got into roles that I had no business doing. And the other kind ofcore theme in my life that went really well for me is that Lincoln startedtaking shape right at the same time, I get started catching fire around 2000and 8, 2010 ish and I was ahead of the curve on that and I started connectingwith people that had the jobs that I thought I wanted. So when I was amarketing manager, I connected with directors of marketing in SiliconValley in new york and Seattle and every major hub when I was a directorof marketing, I connected with VPs and then when I was a VP I starteddirecting with the C suite or connecting with them. And so I matchedmy linked in trajectory with my career very well and the people that I madeconnections with very early are now in those director V. P. And C suite roles.So my network is very expansive and one of the luckiest moments I got, Iremember I was laid off one day and in the same day that was a small startup Iwas working for, that was part of a big big layoff within the same day I gotcontacted by a marketing consultant named bryan Hawn Igman out in new yorkcity and he wrote for new york times, the next web entrepreneur Forbes, hehad this kind of very large market and he was looking for someone to help himscale his writing and he tapped into me to do that because we had connected onlinkedin and because I happened to have been a marketing manager at the time,there was a lot of serendipity that came in there from some of the hardwork I did and I got to double my...

...compensation that day and suddenly Istarted writing about marketing to marketers about marketing which helpedme learn more about marketing, which exponentially grew my skill set Andthen I was suddenly published an entrepreneur and Forbes and then mycareer really blew up and I was 24 so it was very fortunate that brian foundme at that moment, he believed in me and trusted me too learn how to writelike he writes a seasoned professional, do it very quickly and it was some ofthe hardest work that I have ever done. I remember spending 12 hours on anarticle and crying because brian kicked my ass was a red line, red line, redline, red line like this doesn't make any sense, this is you know cognitivedissonance, you don't know how to like and I was just all these emotions ofself doubt started hitting me and he worked with me through that and helpedme become more competent and understanding and that was a veryfortunate scenario and you know there are a couple of situations like thatwhere if I had mentors that have gotten really done what I feel is a lot of thehard work for me, I love that, I love that I love the idea of somebodyreaching down and pulling you up with them that that that's amazing and I andI know that you do that as well, you know you have a lot of time that youspend with other leaders and and even as an executive, you know or the chairof the leadership portion of Pavilion, I wonder in any of that, do you haveany um you know, kind of shake my next question and kind of switch it a littlebit. Usually asking for like a tactic on marketing or anything like that. Butlike I would even be open to just like general leadership advice that youthink people should be considering on a daily or weekly basis. The # one mottothat I have that has gotten me through at least two today is it does well inmy personal life too, but it's always provide more value than you expect inreturn. And I don't remember who it was that told me that, but I was young whenI heard it and it took me a while to really understand what that meantbecause especially when you're younger...

...you're like, well what value do I haveto give right? Like you don't really know what it is yet. So it's notnecessarily that you always have that value to give, but you're alwaysseeking to provide more and more, particularly when it when it comes backto you. Like I have another outcome. Another saying that I have which hassurrendered the outcome, which means do the work that you have to do. And theneverything that is an external circumstance that you can't control.Don't worry about it. So this is really popular when it comes to be DRS likeyou do the work that you have to do. and if somebody flips you off and tellsyou don't want to talk to you, you surrender that outcome because somebodydoes want to talk to you next call. Exactly yeah, same with networking,it's it's surrender the outcome. So I'll reach out to people and I'll textthem and I don't expect them to text me back. Sometimes I'll just say like heyBrandon was thinking about you heard your podcast the other day, I hopeyou're doing well. I don't care if you message me back or not, I would alwaysmessage you back. Jacob. Everyone on the pod knows well my heart, Iappreciate that and that's that's you providing some value back, right? Butthe point that I'm making is that I will do what needs to be doneregardless of my past history of success with that, regardless ofwhether whether or not you have like sometimes I'll have four text messagesin a row that I haven't heard back on. It doesn't mean I stopped thinkingabout somebody. I always keep trying to provide value and I don't take thesethings personally. So great. I love I love it man, this is a great piece ofadvice a little different than where we usually go, but so valuable, I think wetalked often a lot about you know, things like networking and and pullingpeople up and mentoring and stuff and I just love the idea to not expectanything back that you know in my world, that's true hospitality. You're tryingto give and, and hope for somebody else to have a great experience withoutanything wanting in return. So super cool. All right, well look, let's gospeed around a little bit. Um, you know, what are some things or is there anypositions that you're hiring for? You should say? Yeah, we're just getting inthe loop for likely hiring a BDR pretty...

...soon, probably a product manager andmaybe even a growth marketing manager. So these are on the dockets and we'regetting closer to hiring a growth engineer as well. So if any of thosethings strike your fancy or you know, anyone feel free to ping me on linkedin,be happy to facilitate. Amazing. And then give some shout outs. Either upand commerce or folks that folks that you appreciate the content that theyput out. Yeah, there's some folks. Um, the first one that comes to mind isMegan domina and I think she's recently changed roles, but she's a marketerthat I worked with back at clear voice. Again, I worked with her at buddy. Ieven hired her in my company. She's somebody that I've worked with who isuh, she's beyond my pay grade. She's phenomenal work. Maybe we could providea link or whatever and then Demi season she was previously at my fitness paland under armour and she, she was actually the person that hired me toget some of my first content published with under armour have a lot to say.She's a senior PM and all trails right now she's phenomenal. Uh, and then acouple other up and comers, uh, Soraya and she just changed her last name. SoI hope to not butcher this, but it's Soraya Palmisano and she was previouslya Pinterest in now doing some product marketing management work at linkedinstarting here in the next month. So those are the three names, all justphenomenal female marketing leaders that are total badasses that I'velearned a ton from. Yeah, I was going to point out not going to be a surprisethat three women come to mind when you think of who is amazing and coming up.We often such amazing female leaders on the show and, and it makes so muchsense to me. I do say something semi controversial that I truly believe inand I think that women make better marketers than men and it almost feels,it almost feels shameful to say their up and coming because I think they have,you're not in their right. But there are those three that I continuallypoint back to love, love that, love that. Well, um, those are all thequestions for everyone else. For me,...

...there's just one question that matterswhat restaurant we're going to. You can, you can give me any restaurant anywhereand I recognize this and I live in Montana now, Is that a new occurrencesthis like last last 12 months. Well, I, I have a place in incline villageNevada in addition to, so I'm like on the outskirts, so I was already fourhours outside of Silicon Valley. Now I have a house in Montana as well in atown called Whitefish, I don't know the restaurants yet, so you'll catch my,myself, my wife, my two dogs at Panera bread probably two or three times aweek and so I'll take you to Panera bread. I'm a humble guy and you knowwhat? Panera bread is getting kind of expensive. So it's still a very nicemeal. Let me tell you, Panera is probably what I seek out most went onthe road because I'm trying to eat healthier and I know a place likePanera can do that. So like shouts of Panera, also one of the original brandsthat use self, self service order and chaos. So you got to love that from myside of the biz well, I, I pretend it's healthy, but I, I usually go hard onthe mac and cheese or something silly that I shouldn't do. You can, you cango that direction too if you want. Uh, so it's good for the kids, Jacob greatto have you on, man, I'm really looking forward to kind of hearing more like, Ithink that too, kind of, you know, saying that you have really resonatedwith me and and and psyched to just be connected then thank you brianappreciate the time. All right, that's our show. Thank you so much forlistening. If you love the show, rate and review in the apple podcasts orSpotify apps, smash that subscribe button, send it to friends. It makes anincredible birthday gift. Just kidding reminder. This episode is brought youby Inside Squared. Say goodbye to spreadsheet, forecasting and hello toCrm data. You can trust Inside Squared delivers predictive deal scoring,unmatched visibility and inspection and advanced goal management for yourentire team. Everything you need to take back control of the revenueprocess. I had fun today. Hope you did...

...too. Now go crush your numbers, say something. Mhm.

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