The Pavilion Podcast
The Pavilion Podcast

Episode · 7 months ago

Ep 194: SDR Appreciation Week w/ Ernest Owusu, Sr. Director Sales Development at 6sense

ABOUT THIS EPISODE

Ep 194: SDR Appreciation Week w/ Ernest Owusu, Sr. Director Sales Development at 6sense

Part of the TGIM (Thank God It's Monday!) series hosted by Tom Alaimo.

Book. All right, everybody, welcome back to the pavilion podcast. This is your host, Tom Alemo. This is the show where revenue leaders learned the tips, tricks, tactics they need to be successful in their roles. It's Monday, we're getting into it, we're getting after it. Excited, very, very very excited for today's podcast. I've got the legendary earnest a Wu Su coming on for an interview to prep us for str appreciation week, which actually happens next week. So, earnest, if you do not know Ernest, he is a former NFL athlete for multiple years, turned str leader. He runs. He's a senior director of sales development over a sixth sense. He's a CO founder of sales for the culture and he is one of the top ten sales development leaders, just recognized on Linkedin. So Ernest has just leadership in his blood. He has just great both tactics as well as motivation to to share on this episode. So we get into a lot of great stuff surrounding the SCR appreciation week that's happening next week, what he thinks about that, what six sense is doing about that, as well as how he lays out the framework how he, you know, promotes from within, how he challenges people to do better, some of the bouchers that he has as a leader. It's just a phenomenal episode, so I don't need to hype it up anymore. I think you're really going to enjoy let earnest do the work on this one, because he was phenomenal. Before we get to that, just a quick word from our sponsors. This episode of the Pavilion Podcast is brought to you by six cents. Six sense, the number one account engagement platform, helps you identify accounts that are in market for your solution, prioritizer efforts, engage buyers the right way with highly relevant messaging and measure what actually matters. Sense customers report a t x increase in deal sized, ten percent improvement and opportunity conversion rates, twenty five percent reduction in deal to close time and one hundred and twenty percent improvement in revenue effectiveness. That's a lot of percentages. To learn more, you can visit them at six sensecoms revenue collective. Again, I am on Linkedin. Tom Leemo. I work at Gong. You can hit me up. I post every single day about sales and growth mindset. Love to hear your feedback of the podcast. Without further ado, let's get into today's interview. All right, ernest a Wusu, good morning, happy Wednesday. Welcome to the pavilion podcast. How are you, man? I'm great, great, Happy Hump Day, you know, happy to be here. Can Complain. I love it. Man La, last time we talked you were in the initial stage, is of raising triplets, and now we're at like the they did. They hit the two year birthday. Yeah, it's funny and they're not quite too yet. They're actually the we two in late March, but I will say things are definitely getting real, to say the least. Over here. It's been pretty crazy to see what they would do and they're starting to talk a little bit and running around and it's been a lot of fun, though. That's awesome. I remember how you know, one thing that stood out to me last time we talked was you just talking about your your routine, your schedule. I forget the exact specifics, but you know you're waking up super early every day for five in the morning to, you know, work out, to get work in early and and just really try to like set a lot of discipline around your life. I'm curious how the triplets have have kind of, you know, thrown themselves upon you and how you've made adjustments to balance, you know, being there for them, probably working from home still and, you know, making sure you get the work done and everything like that. Yeah, so that was definitely something I learned from my athletic career of just being...

...the early worm again there, you know, Sunday early and making sure that I'm taking avtage of the day. That was a lifestyle. Now it's basically a mandate. I have no choice. would be up early because these kids are running around, obviously. You know. The good thing about it is, you know, still even waking for the crack of don around four or five every single day still allows me to get a lot of work done it and be productive even before. Sometimes they do wake up, but periodically they will poke their heads out and start screaming and running around before the they start. So I'm definitely well prepared, I will say the least, to handle that. That's great. That's great. Well, the reason we're here today to talk is we got an str appreciation week. When this lot, when people are listening to this, it'll it'll probably be the Monday of the actual week itself. Will be in the midst of it. So we've got a lot to talk about. I mean, you're one of the, you know, I think, most influential voices in the SCR world and in the SCR leadership world with this everything that you've built, you know, within the last you know five ten years of your career, you know, post athletic and getting into the sales and leadership world. So maybe you could just educate me a little bit. I don't even know much about seur appreciation week. So is it is there? Is it something that you guys just came up with? Is it a real, like industry wide thing, and like what's the what's kind of the purpose and background by it? Yeah, we would love to explain that. So I guess this actually marks year three of doing bedr appreciation week and you know, what it all stem from? The fact is something that I think a lot of companies inherently know is that bed ours are at the tip of this beer. They are one of the most important aspects of making an organization thrive and at the end of the day, people just don't appreciate the work they do. And this isn't necessarily to say that. You know, everyone deserves to be overpraised and we want to make sure that, you know, always are feeling good. But the reality is there has been some kind of perception that Bedr the bet our job is really easy. It's something that, you know, just an entry level role. We don't really care what they're doing. We're going to we just need them basically do the job basically, you know, smile and out right. And the reality is that is not what this roll is about. And creating an environment where we can take one week per year to just sit down to a knowledge truly how hard of a job this is and how complicated can be, as well as what the team goes through day and day out, is honestly something that I would have really appreciate what I was personally to be Dr and know that you know, as we enter a third year of doing this, that you know we saw, especially with last year, right that you know this whole bed our appreciation thing. Honestly, when virals throughout linkedin where, you know, str bed our teams across the globe and you know, the US and Emmia a pack all over the place. We're spending time to it, really focus it on their team, make sure they're feeling appreciated, and it's honestly the status quote. Now, like we need to have this as something that remains intact because it is a hard role when most that when the most difficult roles within a revenue organization and people need to realize I'd recognize it because he had to. At the end of the day, a lot of people who have not done the role truly don't understand what it takes to be successful, be d are Hmm. And so what what it like during bed our appreciation me like what's top of mine for you, like in terms of trying to make them feel appreciated? Like how would you go about doing that? Is it? Is it a linkedin post? Is it a team meeting? Is it child people out in turn? Really, like how do you handle it? And how have you seen? I know what when it went viral last year, like what were some of the ways that kind of like caught your attention of ways that leaders kind of showed respect and admiration to the team? Yeah, definitely, and I think they're you know, every team is unique, so I think all the leaders out there can spend different ways to better appreciate their teams. Over here at six monce we have a couple things in store and I will mind mind you be appreciate. Your week is the last week of February. I think the last week. It's the week of February twenty one through twenty five. So that's kind of one membership market of the counters and we're to take some measures over here to help other organizations find ways to best celebrate their teams. But what I did see last year in the past couple years is a simple shout out on Linkedin of your top performers, of people are doing really well. Has Been Helpful. One thing we've also...

...seen is when people actually been the time to have executives sit down and watch would be yours are doing to learn about the role. That's also been great. But again also giving btrs opportunity, maybe, like I'm an all hands call, or an opportunity where they could share more brody of the Organization of like what they're actually doing to try and generate meetings that. Those are some things that we've done over here. We've seen other companies do really well. But again, it is important to know that every team is different. Know your team, know kind of how they'll feel, appreciate it and use those measures to make sure they been in lovely deserve. I love the idea of having them run their own meeting or speak out of me. It probably kills two birds at one stone, right, because you, as a leader, are always trying to think of content, to provide a team to run the team meeting. Here's how we do a B or C and if you have someone that's killing it one, it takes the workload off of you into it helps them to kind of shine through, to build their chops a little bit and to, you know, share what's worked with that, you know, Bedr across the York. So I love the idea of doing that. One thought I just had is, you know, I see people shout out their team members on Linkedin sometimes. Actually saw one this morning from a colleague, get Gong. Is there ever in the back of your mind that thought, though, if I put my best Bedr and I shout them out on Linkedin the now all of a sudden all these recruiters are going to bed are and she's killing it and she's leading the team and now she's going to get thirty in males. Yeah, I will say I definitely does come to mind, but what I try and do in that situation is, you know, the other day, this is about them. Like, obviously you know I'm shouting up my top performers. Other companies are to realize that probably started trying to reach out to them, but this is more of an opportunity for me to take care of them, and that is obviously something that I think leaders think about and are conscious of as they're giving these recognitions. But at the end of the day, this time particulars is made to make sure that these bedrs we have are doing an awesome job or field appreciated, and if that's something that I have to risk from my top performers, then so be it. You know, I feel confident in, you know, the pro running over here and our attention rates so with our BEDR team. So it's not necessarily something that I'm too nervous about, but I will say I can understand of others are as well. Yeah, I I think that's that's probably the right way to think about it, but I'm sure if there's always that selfish part of the back of your head, like man, I hope my top my top player, doesn't leave me because I would appreciating them to publicly. Yeah, that's definitely true. So what's we talked, you know, eighteen ish months ago and we were, you know, in the first, you know, probably six months of covid a lot was changing. We just kicked off the New Year. What are some of the the trends and ideas and changes that you're seeing across just the BEDR world, whether it's for leaders or the bedrs themselves, that's standing out to you? And maybe it's a tactic, maybe it's there's so much new sales tech that's coming into the into the fold, new ideas, new trainings, like just curious if there's anything top of mine that you're that has been really successful for you or you're keeping your eye on for the rest of this year. Yeah, I'd say, you know, as we enter into what is this now going to two years post pandemic, the one thing that I saw across all revenue Rs, are probablys of what industry in is some of the reliance of you more traditional forms of generating meetings, of generating pipeline, having conversations were becoming a lot more difficult. In particular some things with trade shows and things that nature. So having a lot more reliance on data as the means to why and how you're making actions, as well as how you're trying to generate conversations, became even more prominent in we're still seeing that to this day. So, you know, for our team, you know, I think fortunately, with what we do at sixth sense, like it's our product, very much aligned to helping companies used to make better decisions, to ultimately build pipeline and, you know, get to where they want to go from a revenue standpoint. But I have noticed that, as people have realized that it can be a bit more challenging given the current environment, that that's really important. I think. Secondly, one thing that people were really apprehensive about, nervous about, is this concept of...

...the bed. Our team has to always be in the office and you know, with your power hours, you're doing your call blitzes, of round the troops around each other. You know, if you don't have that environment that you just cannot succeed. I think you know, Pik, speaking from personal experience, you know from our team as well from others. I think a lot of people have proven that yes, it is impactful and better for culture, for for getting everyone together and driving results, to have people in person. But there are teams are finding ways to win it, which is really promising to see. And you know, on our team here at sixth sense we've found ways to make that work and to still get the job done do a really well at times. When, you know, before Amicron came around, we could, but in general we've been able to adapt and I've been able to see a lot of organizations adapt as well, which has been pretty cool. What are some of the ways that you've adapted from the sales pit and all the different ways that you can, you know, more easily create camaraderie, motivation, accountability. I'm all of that. Like, how have you brought that to the digital world the last two year's? Yeah, and I will say it, that is challenging right. So, you know, there's nothing there's nothing more motivating than having a power hour you're seeing right now, right next to person making calls, hearing them when and you getting competitive want to do it together with them. So we've definitely adjusted. Like on our side over here, we do our powers through zoom, so everyone kind of be on the call together and when someone does get a connect and someone will pause and listen to their call and congratulate when the congratulate them when we win. We also do a lot of virtual events, like we try to have some kind of team event towards the tailing of the year and this year, because of everything going on, if we're going to do a virtual game night, which, you know, we've brought a company on. Raw really excited about that. You know, again, it's the the in person feeling is something that I really really miss. I think our team definitely misses. But overall better experience the best that we can and, you know, using these sessions, are our power hours or our virtual game nights, have been really effective and helpful for us to retain our culture and we're continue to continue keep doing it. Yeahs so tell me a little bit about the to the Zoom Power Hour. You get all the all the bdrs, you know, on a zoom call, is everyone making calls like on Mute and then you on mute if you get someone live? Are you going like one at a time? Call and if you know it's voicemail, you leave the voicemail and that goes on to the next person. Yeah, so we actually because obviously if we're leaving voicemails, we don't want to sit there on a zoom and everyone's talking at the same time. So we are primarily thing on you. But once someone goes off off mute, then that's kind of where we use as a mechanism to share how the calls going and gather feedback. We also use sales engaging tools, sales off, which been really effective for just our live call studio, so we can see how the calls are going, you know, passing feedback to one another, but on muting yourself during our power ours been our best way to kind of share the experience and pass few up to others in live, real situations. I love it. Do you ever get in, or do the leaders ever get in and like make a call or anything like that? We definitely do and you know, I will say I would highly encourage every so often for a leaders to do that, and the reason why I say that is because, you know, this kind of goes back to my sports background, but you know, selling is one hundred percent of skill. Calling, in my opinion, is one hundred and the skill very similar to you know, I hate to use the sports analogy, but that's my background so I'll use it, but it's very similar like playing basketball, shooting free throws right. You know, you can be the best free throw shoot in the rolls and if you take six months off, your game is going to be off right. So your ability to coach and help people shoot is obviously going to be off as well. So you know, it is a skill that has to be constantly refined and there's nothing wrong with getting the pit and make some calls and failing with your team and doing all that because it is fun and that's help the team feel as if we're in it together to win as a team. So I definitely encourage that. And that's the key to is that just because you're the leader doesn't mean you have to be perfect. Doesn't mean that they're going to answer, and if they answer, doesn't mean that you're going to get a beating every time. You know what I mean? It's you're just this is likely to fail. As you know, the SCR Bedr that just started a few months ago, because so...

...much of it is out of your control. Right, you can try to do follow the right tactics, but at the end of the day it's a numbers game and it almost might make people feel better to see you fail, because then it normalizes that. Hey, you know, at least I'm not. You know, it's not that I suck, it's just like this is a tough job, one hundred percent. And one thing we harp on here, which I'd highly encourage others if they're not thinking this way, is, you know, we try to focus more on the process of how we're getting a result as opposed to the actual result. Right, so if I'm in a situation where I'm doing a call like I care about like falling through all the way from start to finish my calling phone, and the reality is sometimes following that process won't net the results I'm looking for. But if I execute that task fully every time in the best efficient manner of my process, then that will net the results I'm looking for in the long run. So it's actually okay if I'm on a call and I get hung up on three times in a row or get yelled at from prospect and from my entire team. I actually don't care about that. The thing I care the most about is making sure that in this extends to every kind of prospecting tactic, to it doesn't necessarily have to only be calls, but I care more about my team seeing that I'm following the process of how we want to call, how on xcument emails, how we want to do our social outreach through the tea, because that consistency around doing that is what will never results from working for when I think about SCR BEDR appreciation week or when any of these things is come up, and it could be, you know whatever, Mother's Day or Father's Day or all these different holidays and weeks and months and everything that we've got, sometimes people say, well, you know, every day should be mother's Day, right, you should appreciate your mother every day, or whatever it might be. Shout appreciate bed ours every week and I know that, based on our last conversation, that you have a very thoughtful framework around how you appreciate bed ours in terms of their career progression, the career growth, their skills development, things like that. So I'd love for you to just unpack that a little bit, because they while it's important to highlight the week, I think it's also important to build out the framework at your company to make sure that the bed ours, you know, have a fulfilling place to work the rest of the year as well. So I'd love for you to unpack that. Yeah, for sure. So I would definitely say for any leader that is in some capacity work with bed ours, whether it directly or indirectly, it is mission critical that you uphold the culture that a bed our team actually needs to thrive, as well as to make sure that you're doing whatever you can to support them. And you know, I think about myself as a leader or even other leaders that are tasked with leading bed our teams, the the servant leadership mentality is something that is very much true and, in my opinions, should be a cornerstone for how people are leading bedrs. And reason for that is because when you bring on a BDR to your team, they're essentially getting a crash course, a crash course in revenue generation, whether that's you know the fact that there are part time marketer, a little bit of obs in there as well as a salesperson. It is our job as bed our leaders to make sure that every single step they take is progressing them for to learn how to be the best version of whatever they may become. Right so, from a career developments standpoint, just putting things in place for give them opportunity to learn about market and give them the opportunity to learn about how to be a salesperson, give the opportunities to gather feedback on how they're doing with those things. If you don't have those things in place, and in my opinion, you're kind of cutting your team short. But in terms of the culture, like one thing that we really harp on here at six sense is we have this we have this acronym that we tie to our values, which stands for family. Family is fun, accountability, mindfulness, integrity, love and yes, and every single week without fail, on our BDR alls, hands called our stand ups, we highlight one person the team that best embodies that culture, not because, you know, we want to constantly praise and overpraise team making will feel good, but for the fact that the matter is this is a really hard job and the team needs to know that the culture that we have is going to basically determine success and failure in their overall experience. And I have to have an environment it's constantly reinforced to make sure the team is feeling appreciated and they are taken care of. And if...

...it's something that you're not talking about on a regular basis and it kind of falls the wayside, and that's where you have environments for bed ours maybe don't feel as much appreciation or feel as much supportant is that acronym for the BEDR orders. That company wide, company wide. We all. You all stand up to it, but it's something that we've you know, from a past almost three years. I've been here at six sense. Literally every single week we harp on it. I love that and the thing is that you know some of those some of the letters they are like accountability, integrity, whatever it might be. Those don't necessarily mean that you had the best week of cold color. It doesn't mean you book the most meetings if you had integrity or account often accountability comes when you fail at something right or you mess up and you're accountable to it. So I love the idea of praising not only the result but, you know, kind of the characteristics that make up someone that's going to be successful and it doesn't matter that you had a bad day or week, that you still did the right thing and that's going to pay off in the log run. Exactly. Yeah, and I think the last thing, I'll even touch on that too, is, like you know, again, being a bdrs really hard job. A lot of people who have not done the role at time struggle understanding what it's like. When I look at beat our teams. We got to stay close together, we got to take care of each other and building a culture that is constantly refined and harped on and people are looking out for opportunities to see you when people are best in bodying. That is a really strong mechanism do that because, again, it is a hard job and it's something that has to be top of mine for the team to feel motivated, to feel all supported to the best of ability. I want to run an idea by you. As you know, your were both to call us both former athletes is almost UN there to you, because I was a d to tennis player and you played in the NFL. But let's just say I admire your your your background in athletics and I heard a story recently from Jordan borrows. He's a gold medalist US Olympic wrestler, and it's on the topic of participation trophies and you know, the general thought is like, you know, millennials and Genz and everyone is getting all these participation trophies and it's making us soft. And he said, you know, actually, I remember when I was first wrestling and you know, I got my ass kicked and I got a participation trophy. And he was, however, old, ten years old, and it was the thing that kept him going. He was like, Oh, this is cool, like you know, this this trophy is cool. I want to go out and like go to the next meet and try to do a little bit better and do a little bit better. And I was thinking about that and in the context of being a Bedr, especially the first year being a BDR, being in sales, it's just it's just hard. It can just suck, like getting told no, getting hung up on trying to figure all this out, and I almost am comparing his story to you know, making those bedrs feel appreciated in that first year for doing the right things, not always just for the results, in that it might just help them get through that really tough time in the first six, twelve months so that they figure it out and then all of a sudden their career takes off. Just I'm curious. I haven't tested this theory or the first person. I'm saying it too, but it's curious, like your plake is on the yeah, that's definitely interesting thing. You know, when I think about beat our teams, you know you do need that thing to get you going because, especially if you're in the organization where getting constant rejection on the phone, through email, through social you have to have some kind of north starlets and guiding you, otherwise you just not going to succeed. And whether that comes in the form of a weekly shout out from your manager or participation trophy every single week org you will time make a call that doesn't go well, there does have to be that one thing that you're looking towards and what I'd highly incurase anyone who, you know, does have a Dr Team that maybe has a lot of higher rejection, which a lot of the team, a lot of the BEUR teams definitely do have, is to really hunker down and help the team understand what their north star is. And the thing that I've always noticed with BEDR ORG is the three guiding principles that kind of keep people going and allowing the push of the hard...

...times. Aside from what we do, want to be your apprecient. We appreciation week is a constantly called the three CS. So it's a focus on creer development, on your culture as well as your conversation. With those three things in mind, you always have something that you can lean towards when things aren't going well or things are hardness to like, this is where I want to go, this is how things are, this is how well I'm getting paid, and based upon those three mechanisms, they kind of help people. There was different right. Like you know, we see at times end sales every some people say, I'm not money motivated. Right, well, maybe your career motivated, or maybe you're motivated by working at a company that treats employees really well. But as long as you have a strong understanding of each person on your team and how he or she is best motivated, that will help them get through those times. I definitely have to see it. Say That I lean a bit more on the camp of not giving a trophy every single week. I think we're appreciation week is an awesome opportunity to give the teams of love and some praise. But if you don't want to basically do the participation trophies every single week. I'm really knowing what your team carries about and what motivates and is probably the most important thing to get love and Supporte neied, I love it. I appreciate you deal with me on that. That seems it's a work it's a work in progress for sure. I want to pivot for a minute to, you know, for some of the the BDR leaders out there that are hiring. So I had an instance. I told you a little bit about this before, but I've got two people in my family that are seniors in college. They're interested in in sales, want to break into tech SDRs, and so I figured I'll throw out a post on linkedin and just see, like, you know, maybe one or two SCR leaders I know will come in and you know, they get interview or at least look at the resume. And it was crazy. It was one of the most engaged posts I've ever had. I mean I got dozens and done. I think I had like hundred something comments and I had two dozen people just go straight to the DM's and say give me there as a Ma or make the even just blind intro. I don't even need to look at the resume just just intro me to them, and I don't think that is because I'm special or because I'm cool. It seems like there's just a massive shift in terms of the power and in terms of like the supply and demand of high quality bedrs and SDRs to the way that that tech companies are growing. I'd love to just hear like how you're handling that and you know, like how are you going about searching out and keeping a healthy pipeline right now, where it just seems super competitive on your side to find the right people? Yeah, I will say it is far more competitive than it's ever been and you know, I definitely look at that as a testament to the fact that more and more organizations are truly seeing the value of having an SDR or Bedr Org. Yeah, I think only that I can put it is, like, you know, more organizations are seeing the value in it. I think the game is up leveling. It's not any more a true smile and dial situation where you just pick the phone, see a list and just call down them. You have to be a little more strategic and thoughtful with how you're doing your outreach. So when I look at the fact that more organizations are seeing the value in it. I'm looking the fact that it's actually a lot more difficult to a job. It continues to be a more difficult job. It does create environment where you get to really like expand the cross your network talks. A lot of people go to events and just try and find opportunities to add to your team, and those aren't always easy to find, especially with the fact that there are more opportunities for other people to take SDR BEDR roles other organizations. What would be your number one tip to an SCR or aspiring SDR BEDR that wants to to get in the door with your org? What's like the number one thing that they can do to stand out in the interview process? Yeah, sure, so we have our principles that we look for when it comes to hiring a SDRs bedrs, and a couple of them are it's actually leak. This actually comes from a book called leading sales development, which pulled data from, I think, sales loft, Alpha sense as well as well sales. For us around one of the main qualities and traits that we're looking for when it comes to hiring strs and bedrs so some of them are a little bit more challenging for people to to do initially.

One of them is business acumen, having great having such a conscientiousness, which is essentially being very thoughtful with every single thing you're doing, and natural form of curiosity is important. So those are things that we look for. And now, in terms of preparing for an interview, which I would say, whether that's our company has six sense or other organizations, being truly curious about the company and what they do will shed light to basically help you. You do all those aspects to make you sit out in your process. So if you really actually care about their product, where they're going, you know who they're selling to, why, things that nature, it'll show your new process, which will also help you demonstrate your overall ability be effective within the entire process. So, and they're also other aspects to like. If you've never been in str bedr role, there are amazing organizations, you know, like a like a flock JSD academy, vendition US some technology. There are a lot of organizations that help people learn how to become SDRs and bedrs. I think even sales for has a course of course era that helps you just learn how to do the role. There's no harm in doing that and talking to potential hiring energy around what that experience would like for you, but also help you understand what the role is actually about. So I highly encourage people who would know nothing about the role, which I will say when I first started I knew nothing about being an SDR, to at least explore from those things in to be naturally curious about what the role entails, what the company is looking for, and that would help you as you're preparing. And most of those are free resources. MMM, exactly. That sere at least. And so you can take a course, you can learn how to use sales force and, you know, learn cold call and email best practices and all this, and I mean you'll look like a stud in the interview process if you know that stuff versus someone that doesn't exactly it. Doesn't it just cost you a time and energy? One hundred percent exactly. All right, earnest, I want to hit you with a couple rapid fires for the audience to get to know you a little bit better, as we're in the back part of the interview process. So I remember last time we chatted you mentioned fanatical prospecting, I believe, by Jet Blunt, as a book that was really helpful for you in your career. So one. Can you confirm them to any others that have stood out to you? They could be business or sales books, they could be a completely different genre, but but anything as of laid or anything else that's been really impactful for you to read. Yeah, so I will definitely say if PANACA prospecting is is my Bible, you want to call it, it's a really strong book. If few are looking for anything tactically, mindset wise, whatever may be, at a highly encourage I want to take a look at that. I also encourage people to take a look at just anything in general mindset focused around, you know, upliving your game and how you want to attack your sales career. And the reason why I say that is because, again, being in sales, being an str bigger bdr, is very much of a skill and you have like your mindset is essentially the foundation that allows you to build the skills to help you get the results you're looking for. And without a strong mindset, or at least the practice of making your mindset even stronger than your ability to reach a potentials it's at time. At times can be diminished. So I think tactically the bit, you know, on the mindset, on the mindset side and not a prospecting still my best. But you know, I'd also encourage others look at any kind of mindset books as well, because those are typically the foundation for what helps fuel how you're selling and higher prospecting. Any any mindset books stand out to you? There's a book called mindset. I don't know who the offer author is, but that's the one of my own back exactly. Yeah, so my wife's a coach. We've actually both write it together. So I'd encourage everyone to read that one. Okay, yeah, that that's a top five probably all time for me. It could blew my mind. I'd agree. I'd agree. Okay, who else in the work in the you know, kind of like sales, sales development world, defollow and take the advice from, whether it's on Linkedin, pod cast, Youtube, blogs, newsletters? Would, however, you like to learn who are some people that have stood out to you? Yeah, so I'd say if there's one person...

I highly encourage strs to take a look at as Kyle Coleman. I think Kyle Coleman's common is really strong in terms of crew development, in terms of how to craft an email, in terms of how to navigate the organs an str. He's consistently been a really strong voice out there to champion SDRs. I definitely focusing on him. I'd say, if I have the name, one other person, though he's not very active on Linkedin. I think for str leaders are really strong. Leader is Lars Neilson. He's been someone that you know. He's currently now a snowflake. If you're ever looking to at someone and model your career around, or someone who's kind of built an SDR organized in an awesome way, he's definitely one of the people the forefront of that. So I'd say Kyle Coleman from a pure content standpoint of what he puts out there and help SDRs. But I think for SDR and be your leaders, large is always been one of the best out there. So finding way to mirror to some degree what he's doing is definitely something I had encourageable to do. Yeah, a lot of respect for Lars and Kyle Coleman. He's top, top one percent terms of tactical content on Linkedin. To follow both for leaders and for STRs I I'm in the frontline manager school at Pavilion and he actually ran it. KD Kevin Dorsey's running it like the whole thing, but he stepped in, Kyle did yesterday, to run a session in a dude is just I mean he's just that. He just nails everything. He's just super thoughtful, dialed in. Has Done it before a multiple company. So I would second that vote for sure. He's great, awesome. Yeah, I agree. All right, I don't know what is bumping in the spotify, apple music, wherever you're playing tunes, like what's going on the headphones nowadays? That's a great question. You know, I will say I don't know when or how this happened, but I think may randomly I was on Youtube one day, but low fine music has been in heavy rotation from how it happened. But you know, in particular s and s hiphop would low fly. I've been all over that. So I can't say it's one artist or a particular playlist, but it's still will find music been to get me going, man. That's it's crazy say that because that's the same for me. I don't know, maybe the last like three to six months. I clicked it once because I didn't even know what that meant. And for people that are way, it's kind of like a chiller version of like hip hop beats, and it's great to work too and great to kind of like focus in on. And now every time I go on youtube it's like what if Wood Tang clan made what low fight running invested? And so's their music, but it's kind of like slowed down to or change the beat a little bit, and it's like it's addicting. I don't know what's going on with it or if it's a brand new genre, but I'm all in on to Ye, it's exact same. That's actually how I start most of my days, to be honest. So it's yeah, I'm ind to it, I like it. I like it. Okay. What is your number one networking tip for people? HMM, that's a great that's a great question. If I can give people one piece of ice on that, I'd say sometimes a lot of people isn't necessarily as good as the right people. Right. So, if you're networking, like have a reason as to why you're doing it, like are you trying to find a job? Are you trying to uplove with your game. Are you trying to like build opportunities sales perspective, build opportunities within Your Business? Like know what you're trying to do and target those people accordingly. It's not always about just like saying out blind connection quest to everyone because they're in your network and you know they could have a conversation with you, but be really intentional with why you're doing it and folks on the people you want to have a conversation with. I love it. My last rapid fire for you is who would you like to see come on this podcast next? HMM, that's a great question to hit you with the referral. Let's see if I could think of one person. HMM, it's a...

...toughie. It's a toughie. Multiple of you want. Well, I'm I think one thing that I would love to see is I'm part of this organization called sales for the culture, where we basically help people either come into tech or currently in tech and sales rolls. Black individuals it coming coming to tech or already sales just have a voice or an opportunity to share perspectives and learn from each other. You know, we've been in running for I guess two years now, maybe more than two years. So we have some awesome leaders over there like Jacob and Shelton and Marcus as well, who I think they might have been in some podcast, maybe not through pavilion, but I always appreciate their perspectives and I think they'd be strong people have a conversation with. I know I know who marcus night is. What were the sorry, what were the first to people's names? Jacob and and she'll I'll pass you their linkedins afterwards, but they've been under stones and helping us the our program okay, awesome. Yeah, I had had Nikki Ivy on my pot in December and she introduced me to Marcus. So, but I don't I don't think I know the other two side love the intro. Yeah, before we head off earnest, I know like one obviously, you know, kind of like put a bow on this Dr appreciation we can. We've talked about I know that the folks over at sixth sense or doing a lot to help encourage that, to help kind of like blow this up a little bit more, even more than the virality it had last year. So I'd love for you to just, you know, kind of like educate the audience a little bit on how they can get involved, what they should be looking out for, things like that. Yeah, I appreciate that. So be our appreciation week is February twenty one. Who Twenty Five? I think easy way for companies to get involved is we're in of people the opportunity to either have bdrs or, as to ours, non nominate themselves, or leaders within the organization nominate some of their top drs and we'll share some awards that they can basically place people in and there will be an awards ceremony on February twenty four. And aside from that, like you, feel free to follow me, feel fruit, feel free to follow our CML, Latiny, Lanny Conan. I'll pass that over to using pass through everyone else, but both of us are are basically champion is to the best our ability because we obviously know what it's like and why he was actually, will say in our semi Lanney was a Bedr for a day a couple years ago, so she she got the phones, make us a call, doing some videos, so she knows it's like. So we're definitely we're championing this and it's definitely an opportunity for organizations to step up and and really just for one week, one week in the year, show some love to their bedrs and look out for us as well as our organization share information to help people find ways to do that. But I think a really easy way is our awards ceremony we're having the twenty four and the opportunity to nominate us and mutuals awesome man. So we will let everyone know about the links to that and help promote those as well. I assume in general you're going to be posting about some of this on Linkedin, so it's probably good to either connect with the r follow you on there. Yep, I would. I agree with that. Yeah, so there will be a couple of things will do weekly throughout throughout February, but I think the culmont point will be our awards ceremony. So look up for my content because I'll definitely posting awesome. Yeah, highly encourage everyone to to check her in. Her so out, both for BEDR appreciation week but just in general. When he's posting great and thoughtful advice, hit him up on Linkedin. My last question for you couldn't let you go without asking a football question. Who's got the Super Bowl this year. My patriots got just embarrassed on Saturday, but a figure you've been in the NFL for you got. You know, it's interesting. So I'm definitely biased, to say the least, towards the parts you're going to say. I want to do. It's the Bux to, because I, yeah, don't, don't kind of playoff time. So that's all I gotta say with that. He's going to find a way to win and know, though there was a wild card, I still feel like there's a pretty good shot that will make the super bore again. Awesome, tiers, I appreciate you coming on everyone again. Go definitely follow him and get ready for be DR appreciation. We coming on February twenty one. Awesome. Thanks...

...much. All right, that episode was brought to you by six sense, powered by AI and predictive analytics. Six sense helps you unite your entire revenue team for the shared set of data to achieve predictable revenue growth. Again, hit me up on Linkedin. My name is Tomal LEMO. I work over at Gong. Would love to hear your feedback and, until next Monday, will be back them with another episode. GET AFTER ITS.

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