The Pavilion Podcast
The Pavilion Podcast

Episode · 1 year ago

Ep 31: Virtual Selling in 2021 & Beyond feat Joe Venuti and Dre Lydon

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Virtual Selling in 2021 & Beyond feat Joe Venuti and Dre Lydon

Hello and welcome to the revenue collective podcast. My name is Casey. Let Gordon and I'm your host. Today I have the unique opportunity to have two guests on the show. Joe Venuti and Dre. London of Sin does. So we're gonna talk about virtual selling in 2021 beyond and how they don't see it as just this moment in time, but that it's really here to stay. It's unique to get to speak with both of them because they're both in leadership as well as execution. And so, hearing these two, these two team members talk about what virtual selling has looked like for them building a virtual culture. And how do you maintain momentum while also having immense empathy for your people? It was a really great and honestly fun conversation, so with that, I'm going to get us started. But first, the Revenue collective podcast is powered by outreach. The sales engagement platform for the modern sale. Zorg. Don't just take our word for it. The VP of sales a tableau. They say that they run their entire business from outreach and snowflakes. Enterprise sales director says outreach is the pillar toe how they've been able to scale. Want to see with the number one sales engagement platform can do for your business? Head over to www dot outreach dot io Toe. Learn more. You'll get an inside view at how outreach brings efficiency, visibility and versatility to modern sales teams. Again, that's w w w dot outrage dot io. With that, let's talk to Dry and Joe. Hello and welcome to the revenue collective podcast. My name is Casey. Let Gordon and I'm your host today. I have sinned. Oh, so joining us and I have two of their team members. And I think for those of you listening, both the executive and our reps are gonna love this because we have two representatives or two perspectives being represented here. My first is Joe Venuti. He's the VP of inside sales at sin. Does so and then I also have Dre Leyden, who is the director of sales development at the company. So, having these two together, I think we're going to cover a lot of really good ground. Welcome to the show. Thank you. It's great to be here. Yeah, thanks for having us, Casey. And for all our listeners, you might you might notice us doing a little podcasting Ping pong here because we have three guests. And so the zoom 2020 challenges of who speaks when bear with us. Because we might have some of it. E mean disclaimer. Right, guys? Okay, so why don't I give you all a moment just to introduce siendo so and also your respective roles within the organization? Just so we situate our audience. And what is the world we're talking about? Sure you could go. Oh, man, I was gonna totally like riding your coattails over. Here s Oh, hey, everybody. Andrew linen. Everybody calls me Dre. I had the opportunity to actually joined the str leadership team with Joe the beginning of Cove in so to talk about being a crazy ride. It has been exciting, crazy and only a couple of gray hairs that you could see in here. So I'm excited. I get toe, have the responsibility. Thio really run our enterprise segment really trying to uplevel our team members and also have some really cool projects when it comes to some growth initiatives inbound optimization. And we actually recently started an account management team that is looking thio to stores up cells and cross cells. And then Joe take us home. Sure. So Joe Venuti. I am the VP of incense sales. I've been with Santoso just over two years now. I was actually the first Arizona based higher I was brought into, basically, building scale, the sales development team. So for a couple of weeks, it was just me recruiting fast forward. I don't know. Two years and a quarter or so there's not about 40 total people in New York. There's a total of six teams that are ultimately, um, that I'm ultimately...

...responsible for. So it's everything outbound, everything inbound and then, obviously the enterprise segment, as well as the installed base team that Dre was just alluding to. I think I have probably accrued a few more gray hairs than her by age. Probably doesn't help either, but at the same time, it's been an absolutely wild ride. Never experienced growth like we've seen. The ability to create a category has been a whole new challenge outside of just building high performing sales teams. Um, that was what excited me about the role that Sando so is you know, I love kind of building things from the ground up. The challenge that I wasn't really expecting or maybe wasn't prepared for was, you know, the category creation side of it. But I've learned a ton and it's been it's been an awesome experience. I find that once you're in that space of creating a brand new category becomes a bit addictive and you know the ability to really imagine what isn't there today. Educated audience get them excited, riled up. It's in my experience having done it. It's one of the best best things I've ever done. Yeah, I couldn't agree more. It's been just like full of learning experiences and obviously challenges and roadblocks. But I think that's half the fun, like navigating through all of that. But it's been very, very interesting to land in a sales role with the team where you know, initially when you look around, there really wasn't a ton of competitors and now, like as competitors air popping up in this, you know, other companies in the same space, which is which is a really, really good thing. But it's exciting when you kind of look at the website. There's not 10 other companies that look exactly like you. You know, I have interviewed for jobs or looking for jobs in the past. Where every website looks the same, all the pricing looks the same. You almost can't tell yourself apart. There's a big, big differentiator when you're creating a category from scratch and kind of be the leader in the space. Totally. And I think, as we you know, the topic of today's conversation is virtual selling in 2021 beyond. And a couple of the topics will cover, you know, in our time together is virtual sales were here to stay. And even when we go back, Thio normal. I put that in giant air quotes. Who knows what that will look like? But how do we adapt now? How do we take this moment in time and really set ourselves on a trajectory? Thio differentiate and be ahead of the trend of our competitors, etcetera. How do you virtual I or pardon me? How did you humanize virtual selling? I think that is one of the, uh, Dre. I want to hear from you on that because you join the leadership team during Cove in and I can only imagine the complexity of you know what that looked like and you get toe, walk the walk, not just talk the talk with that. And then how do we master creativity in sales? And I think that not only in category creation, but then you layer on the reality of what 2020 has been from a virtual environment. Creativity has become incredibly important when you're differentiating amongst your competitors set. So I'd love to tee it up to start with Joe having your perspective on when we went virtual and, you know, over the past, Gosh, what is at eight months now? Nine months. And as you're looking into 2021 what are some of the key learnings you've had around developing a team constructing it, making sure there's connectivity. And how are you using those as momentum going into the new year? Yeah, I mean, I think like that's the ever present challenge right now. When we built this team from the ground up, it was laser focused on culture and like higher into the human being. And I could tell you I let some pretty good sales people, you know, walk out of interviews without offers because I was worried about the culture piece. So we did a really, really great job of building a cohesive team. And then they genuinely enjoy working together and, you know, eight months into working from home, the chief complaint is like I miss my friends. You know, I miss going out for lunch together. We're getting a drink after work and like that stuff, you can't think so as we pivoted to work...

...from home. We've been very intentional about remaining engaged with the frontline team. Um, you know, I didn't realize how maney problems or issues I was able to solve. Well, making a cup of coffee. Now it's, you know, gotta set up a zoom called, uh, you know need to be very intentional about a slack conversation. So all of those, like 1 to 1 interactions that I think that we very quickly dismissed have completely gone away. So it's being very, very intentional about, like your communication methods. As we look into next year. As we continue to grow and continue to scale this team, the number one priority is hiring, right? So we need to bring good quality people in the hiring profile is definitely changed because on boarding and enablement is more difficulty in a remote for us. You know, we pride ourselves on being able to hire to, you know, three main things, which was great coach ability and intrinsic motivation. You know, now that experience peace is a little more important than it was before. You know, we have a robust tech stack, and if somebody has never used, you know, a salesforce or an outreach like it's really, really hard when you can't lean to the personal that's next to you would be like, Where's that button or how do I create this opportunity? So it's mastering those small little nuances that used to be solved with Hey, can you help me for five minutes in this world when everyone's, you know, posted up in their living rooms and needed to communicate over slack? So, yeah, I mean, for me, like the big, big focus is getting, you know, mortgage good quality bodies in the door, protecting the culture that we've tried so hard to build, but also making sure you know leadership in the enablement team is all in lockstep or being able to get people ramped well, lending support to the folks that have been here for a while, you know it za startup were ever changing. Wherever evolving of 2020 has taught us anything, it's get comfortable, you know, in change when that happens, Just because someone's been a top performer for, you know, a year and a half two years doesn't mean that they're gonna master every skill set. So how do you continue to check in with them? How do you make sure that you know you're enabling everybody from your top performing most tenured rip to the person that just started Monday? That is by far the biggest thing to tackle to make sure that this team continues to execute a high level. I'm curious your thoughts on this is I was hearing you talking and ruminating on my own experience of being a manager and a team leader during the virtual environment that we find ourselves in. I found that my ability to be an individual contributor was much more limited because I had to be hyper aware of an in tune of to your point at the beginning, my communication style, where it might you know, a slack conversation or over the desk conversation might have felt really simple before, but we're all just inundated with virtual conversations and that screen time, and I find it with my team and I find it with my customers. Everybody s. So it's making sure you're reserving that virtual interaction to make it count. Not having it just be thio. You know, being careful with the culture, because I think that could become ruinous if you use it to frequently. And as a manager I had to be. I had. It couldn't be in the moment necessarily off the cuff communication. I needed to be really thoughtful about how I was interjecting that into my team's day because it could so easily, um, it could have so easily derail them. And I love what you said of There's the balance of you have new people coming into the organization. Traditionally, it's an all hands on deck toe on board and make people feel welcome. But in this environment, your existing reps, your existing team and they're still need a tremendous amount of support coaching, um, sounding board etcetera. And so I find that it's the management layer. Really. All layers have taken a significant change with that management layer what your day looks like. And...

...this was my experience really transformed. And I'm curious if you're if you've noticed those same things. Yeah, You know, I always had a pretty busy calendar and you know, now if you look at it, you know it will give you anxiety because it's back to back to back and your double booked a lot of times. But, you know, I think the other point that you just kind of touched on is just like those one on one like interactions, right? Like I I sat right in the middle of the str team. I was very engaged sometimes, like, you know, I was the biggest distraction as faras Hey, you send a meeting, ring the bell or, you know, high fives all around like I don't have the ability to do that anymore. And as my calendar gets busier and busier, you know, I rely Andre and the other managers in the organization to make sure that, you know, they are laser focused on the front line. I'm very intentional about setting up a couple of like, skip level one on ones a week, and I don't really go into those with an agenda. It's just so that they know like, Hey, I'm here, You know I'm a resource. How can I help? You know, I set up like once a quarter. I kind of pick a week and meet with every single individual, and it's not scalable it. It's largely taxing. I mean, it's, you know, 35 hours worth of meetings in a week. I mean, that's the majority of daylight, right? But it has to be done like you can't just let reps it on an island because it's so hard to diagnose when they're struggling. When you're in the office that you can quickly identify, this person seems a little bit off, you know, let me check in with them. And maybe it's just something in their personal life. Who knows? It could be anything. But those things are so hard to dissect early on when you don't have that face time any more than you need to be very intentional about your interactions and really trying to ask those pressing questions that you can lend support wherever it might be. You know, the other downside to this work from home environment is, you know, a lot of people struggle with the mental health side of it, and it's really, really hard for me to get in front of that now. So the only way that we could do it is continuing to check in true. Try to pick up on you know how people are feeling what people are saying, you know, and jump in and do what we can to support them as quickly as possible. Dre, I would love. Yeah, I would love to hear your point, you know, perspective as one a member of a team and then now moving into leadership and that evolution for you. Yeah, it was kind of interesting, because when I started obviously coming in in a director level, you know, I was going to come in with a specific philosophy and sales methodology. And so I was literally in the office three days, and then we started working from home and everybody that knows me, I'm very direct, right, And I have pretty high expectations for my team. So it took me a lot to learn a whole new company. Ah, whole new culture and wait new ways that I could still be myself. But get convey my message in an impactful way. So, you know, Joe and I the first couple of weeks, they're like, man graze coming in here hot. And I needed to be like, Hey, you guys like I'm excited and you know, I'm excited about this, but I'm not like mean or I'm not trying to it. So it looks like you just have to be so specific about an intentional intentional about what? You're gonna be pro facing to the reps, right? And it's hard. It was so nice when you came into the office and I say good morning and you get to know people from the report or Hey, somebody just had an awesome call. We all kind of rally around that. Now you have to be very intentional on bringing those coaching moments in. Hey, guys, here's a call on outreach or sales loft that somebody just crushed it or Hey, this email is really resonating. Let's find different ways that we could do it. And the other part is bringing your authentic self in right, your dogs barking. You know there's husbands working in the background, and so I think it's also in order to get to know each other and create that culture. We also need a carve out time to really get to know each other as humans. And so I feel kind of fortunate in this aspect because you know what? Maybe took me a year to get to know my reps at previous companies or, you know, a couple of months I really get to, like, be in their bedrooms or be in their...

...house and understand, you know, really what their life looks like so that I can kind of coach and develop them in better ways, understanding who they really are. So you know, it's definitely harder to just make sure that we can be intentional and intentional and spend time with all the reps. But it also has some really good benefits to understand like that we could make an app impact and that work is within their professional and personal lives and really coaching that individual. I think the other key thing on this is like this is probably a lesson that a lot of leaders learned. There's no emotion in slack and email, so you can ask what in your mind is just a very innocently Hey What's up with this kind of question? And it's perceived as oh, like, did I screw this up? Like, you know, and like, that was a lot of feedback that, like, you know, we received early on is, you know, I felt like I was in trouble there. No, Like I was literally just asking what happened with this off, where typically I would have leaned over the desk had been like, Hey, how did that call go? But when you send it over slack, it's it's just a different experience. So do my best to use emojis like anything to kind of lighten the mood. So they know that Hey, I'm not pissed. I'm just checking in here. Um, like, I think that was a really big learning early on, because your default to slack, right? You go work from home. I can't talk to you. So what's the next best thing? I'm gonna send you a quick two seconds slack, but the way those perceived on the other end and I get it like, you know, you're a new arrest er and all of a sudden, like, you know, your new VPs asking about this opportunity and you instantly goto like Is this bad? You know, another example is even meeting advice. Right? I mentioned how I do check ins. Typically, if I just put like Dre and Joe one on one, you know, with with one of the SDRs, I instantly get the slack in my in trouble. No, absolutely not. Like, should you be? Is there something I don't know? I just want to see how you're doing. So, like the context behind these things is so important. It was challenging. Never had to think about in office completely. I I found that. And I actually wonder if this is a good thing to stay, especially for your sales. You know, professionals were communicating with people all the time that we aren't in office with our customers, even in a normal selling world. So the ability to realize that setting up intention for every meeting context for every meeting, being overt communicators so that your customer, just like you're talking about your employees are coming in so well equipped to contribute to a conversation, removing any social anxiety, removing any of those unknowns. It's made me have a lot of empathy or at least free framing of How could I take some of this and create process around it both internally and externally? Yeah. I mean, I think that's a great point, right? Especially in the external side. I think that most companies, most teams, much like ours, went through a change in strategy right around the time that we went work from home, right there was a lot more leading with empathy, a lot more, you know, human to human connections, like the days of steamrolling somebody into a meeting and ultimately, you know, across the finish line to a closed deal. And those days are gone. So if nothing else comes out of this pandemic and this work from home, and someday if we all go back to office like the one thing that I hope we don't lose is the human side of selling. I think that, you know, in the rat race that is SAS sales, and everyone's scrambling for quote er and Presidents Club and everything else that's out there. You I think it's easy to lose the ability to be human about your interactions and thoughtful about every email and every message that sent there was a moment of re centering where that had to become front and center. And I think that a lot of companies and a lot of reps and a lot of prospects are better for that. So I hope that that particular piece never goes away. Is that how you all are looking at? You know, the concept around humanizing virtual sales is that I would love to hear how you all its window. So are looking at how this moment in time has impacted how you will operate moving forward. Yeah. I mean, you know, the day that we went...

...work from home, there was, you know, a lot of meetings right away around How do we revamp our messaging? How do we, you know, revamp everything that we're doing right? It was imperative that we didn't just come to a screeching halt. So one of the things that I was most proud of, one of like the moments where our entire leadership team came together and I'm talking like from our founders, right down to every manager on the go to market team basically revamped everything that we were doing and took on a project that would take months and basically hammered it out in a couple of weeks and reveal again like we were just able to keep moving forward, right? We had a change. We were selling change the way that we were talking. It wasn't just about steamrolling people into the next conversation. It waas genuine human conversations, right? You may have a lot of conversations where you're not going to come out of it with a meeting or an opportunity or a deal that's moving to pipeline. And that was all of a sudden, okay, because you were building relationships. Fortunately at siendo. So we sell a product that really kind of bridges this this gap of personalization. So we were able to kind of double down and, you know, drink our own champagne and really leverage the window. So platform to keep the sales development team moving forward, which is obviously fueling the account executive team and allowing them to keep moving forward. Yeah, I'm curious. You mentioned something around. It was suddenly okay that we weren't, um, every conversation didn't lead to the deal or didn't lead to the next step. That there was this acceptance of its okay that we're building relationships and we're investing now. for the long term. Has that endured during this? I mean, at some point, we have to make money, right? At some point, the deals do need to move forward. And I'm curious how you balance that of relationship versus We have bills to pay, so to speak. Yeah. So I think that it's all about pointing the team in the right direction, right? I mean, everybody has some sort of system. Where There, you know, a council teared out an intent data. So many tools out there. So I think it's about working smarter and doubling down in the areas where you know, probably still have budget or maybe less impacted. And as you kind of work your way down that listen to the companies that are a little more impacted, you know, just cause it's not pipeline today, making a lasting impression. It's a great place to circle back in a quarter or two quarters, so it's not like he's dead in the water forever. It's just being mawr intentional about understanding, you know, each bucket of the accounts or of your territory, you know, in kind of pushing the right levers at the right time. You've got to be much more intentional about every piece of vote. And I think, you know, just a supplement that I think just the concept of brand and advocacy is more important than ever, right? You know, we wanted to create and we want our STRS to be the face of Sando so and so that when they're calling people you know, every week is a little bit different in 2020. We want them to provide such a great experience that we hope to get that meeting. But we hope that that prospect remembers us, right? And we remembers the great words, the personalization that we did, how creative we were to send something that was very specific to their KPs or something that's in their personal interest. So I think you know, advocacy and brand as long as you have your troops, you know, help being held to cultural values. And, more importantly, just thinking about it's not a this is going to be, you know, sign of a meeting or you're dead to me of a relationship of even if you don't choose us. Even if the demo isn't something that you're looking for, you know we want to give you some expertise and some best practices that other you know, marketers or sales leaders, air having. And hopefully we can both come be better from this conversation. So I think, like, really just understanding, brainstorming and not really thinking about different ways to collaborate with our prospect. He's not necessarily selling them, and I think that's something that will be true to our...

...brand since I started and still something we're seeing to this day and into next year. Think that's fascinating because what you just said, I think that that is certainly some of the traditional profiles of sales and marketing leaders. But I think that there are, you know, those of us and I can certainly follow this campus Well, that really loved the win and maintaining momentum and maintaining culture and incentive and buy into what we're doing when maybe the world is looking a little different. I'm curious, you know, maybe Joe, from your perspective of leading a team, how do you maintain that? That incentive, I guess. Yeah, so I think it's I think it's a hard one, right, going back to the conversations that are not going to result in like instant pipeline or instant meeting for SDR. The message that I was kind of passing after the team was just like, understand that everybody is on an even playing field, all right? It's not Mr and Mrs CMO from this company versus you, the SDR from Santoso, your two human beings who are quarantined in your house. There's a lot of really fear out there, like you're both experiencing all the same emotions. So, like leverage, that human connection and, you know, build that relationship. Keep that relationship going forward as to how to, like, keep the team motivated and keep driving towards the number. Ah, lot of that comes from the culture peace and the competitive spirit. The profile of people that we tried to hire right, the reps air hungry. There's still a promotion path internally, and Sandoz, so there's still the ability to hit your quota and overachieving quota. So again, it's point them in the direction of where they're gonna have the most velocity, with the least with the least friction doubling down in the verticals in the areas that we're seeing success, there was a lot like another great moments how much we were always pretty good at sharing information, right? This SDR found something that's working well so that they didn't hoarder. They would share it with the team that has grown exponentially were really good at it. I would say Now we're great at it. So if one STs finding this message worked or, you know, I sent this link didn't note to a couple of prospects or I created this template inside of outreach, they're sharing that we're doubling down the areas that it's working. You know, The other thing is that a leadership level? I've never worked as close with marketing as I do now. Granted, I've got the benefit of an amazing marketing team. But the fact that str leadership in marketing leadership are in lockstep. It is insistent, like all hands on deck campaigns that were running. So we're basically creating this groundswell of everything, Santoso. And then by the time the individual rep gets to you, it's a very personalized experience, right? It's not just you, the CMO are you the VP. It's you, the human. You know, you the person that graduated from whatever college went to. Are you the person that's a fan of this sports team or some club that you know that you're a part of whatever it might be. So we're able to create this, like, holistic groundswell so that people are introduced to send. Oh, so like, Gray said, You know the bread is out there. The bridge is strong, and then an SDR comes in with something really, really relevant that speaks to you. The human, like you're more than just a VP of marketing. So that is what drove the team to continue to produce. And, you know, of course, there's a tons of contests we do internally. Also, it's a special way. Do all the fun stuff, too. They keep them moving forward. Is there competitive group? But, you know, you just kind of had to take the good with the bad. You have reasonable expectations and, you know, any conversation is kind of a good conversation. Even if the person's, you know, not in a great place or not able to take a meeting, you know, just, you know, move on and file that went away to circle back with. So I really like the way you talked about that of recognizing helping coach your reps that this is a very much an equalizing moment in time that you're you probably have never been more relatable to your audience than us universally going through this experience. I think that's...

...pretty powerful advice and especially coaching some, maybe more junior younger reps. I'm curious from your perspective, as we are going into 2021 right now. So many people are looking thio. Next year they're finishing up, you know, this year, closing out, looking at planning. You all said that you you think virtual selling is here to stay, and there are some things that you would recommend organizations and teams are doing to get ahead in 2021. I would love to talk about some really specific items that the teams or team leaders could be thinking about going into the next several weeks. Yeah, I mean, I don't think it's anything radically different from what the best practices have always been, right. Personalization is Keith. The days of putting, you know, 3000 people into a very generic email campaign and pressing sending, like hoping you get a reply like that's not gonna work anymore. And if we go back to the office if we stay home like that just simply isn't gonna work right. It's now a world where you've got to reach out. No, the person on an individual level, the best you can and have, like a one on one meaningful impactful conversation. I look at it in three buckets, right? You could do like your high level, like social outreach kind of posting. And that's where you know you're targeting the company, right? Like you are an employee of X company. This is why you should know about send out. So now the individual collateral that I'm sending you, your director of marketing. This is why directors of marketing should care about Sando. So and that's where we partner with our marketing team. Really? Really Well, is coming up with really, really great content that speaks to the individual personas. And then by the time that the SDR gets to you, there's that personal experience, right? You've kind of we've created this groundswell where you've seen Sandoz on a non invasive way. Ah, whole bunch of times. And now that conversation is warm. It's something that you're a little interested in, something that you're intrigued about because you've seen it in five or six places, very noninvasive, and I think like that's The'keeper's successes. We move forward into 2021. It's gonna be a collaborative effort across several teams inside of your organization to create brand and to create awareness and then trust your frontline SDRs to go in there and deliver a personalized, well thought out message. I think that's a really very tangible and point in the sense that we do need division of labor across the customer journey, the same people who are the SDRs who are taking that meeting and, you know, having that relationship with the customer. They're not the same team that is gonna be responsible for mass outreach that is going to be so limiting because you are goingto, if every conversation you're having is not turning into a deal, that's just the reality of where we're in right now, especially with the virtual environment. Is that you, as each team has to do as much as they can within their start and end part of the journey to set the next one up for success, and I wonder if it's less about in reframing it that hey, marketing, you were doing this in order not to just hit your KP eyes. But that's so that the SDR is able to successfully deliver on whatever there's are that idea of team. I find that when you know team members are accountable to each other versus just themselves or their boss, that the work product goes up. And so that interconnectedness is, is one thing I heard there that I think is is really tangible, that any of our listeners could take away e. I think like creativity is the new form of personalization, right? That is something that we talk about all the time because you know our market department getting back to Brandon Advocacy. They're putting out all of this amazing thought leadership that the SDRs can continue thio leverage in their voice. But you know, it's not about Hey, I saw you on LinkedIn and here's your KP ice. It's really about being unique, right? Everybody is...

...getting hundreds of emails. So now to really stand out, it's really about being creative, and it's about having backup from, you know, your from marketing department, providing air cover, providing really good thought leadership and in giving the SDRC and the account executive really good use cases and customer led selling so that they could deliver value on these first conversations, whether it becomes pipeline or not. So I think you know one thing I wanted to dive into mhm. Yeah, And I think that the other thing is, you know, let your reps whether there s t r a s, let them focus on what they're really, really good at. I think that, you know, historically, ah, lot of teams will try to make everything plug and play. At the end of the day, there is no silver bullet. You know, I could think of, like, just a couple of the top reps on on our team. Now they are polar opposite personalities. So what works for one of them is simply not gonna work for the other one. Right? Everybody comes a different backgrounds, different experiences, different strong suits. So empower them to double and triple down on what their experience tells them and where they know they're great and then have them partner with someone that's great in other areas, they can continue to help up level each other, all of the training, all the amendment doesn't need to come from leadership. You're gonna learn more from your peers because they're doing it, you know, eight hours a day, 40 hours a week, sometimes more so I don't make you know, 150 cold calls a week. I just don't Everybody on the team does. So get that information sharing. Going, you know, like that has been another key thing. We've empowered a lot of our leaders to really become player Coach is without the title, and one of the interesting dynamics I've noticed is more and more of these talk performing STRS are now telling me I want to move into leadership. When they walked in the door saying like direct line to 80 How do I get there? But now they're getting a taste of like we'll bring them into interviews will bring them into on boarding. Well, let them do shadow sessions will point new hires in the direction of them. I'm hearing more and more. You know, I really like this part of the job. Can you mentor me to help me become, you know, the next manager or a team lead or whatever it might be? So I think that it's kind of opened up a new career path for a lot of people, too. I think that is one very important thing that we take away from. This is that right now we are being in a virtual environment, going back to our earlier point. Many of us air craving, alternative connection. We're craving other ways to engage and get that fulfillment. And so being allowing your team members to grow and develop one that's great talent, retention and acquisition play of pouring into them and developing them as individuals but allowing them thio grow and expand. Like you, said Joe. Maybe not title directly, but their skill set in this virtual environment. And maybe check off a couple of boxes of that interconnectivity of that connection and then from there, just the exposure there now seeing different paths. And I think that I would be interested on the other side of this. How many of our our sales reps of our sales leaders marketing leaders begin Thio to see other emerging past that they want to go into because of this moment in time, to your point earlier, more of the pure level sharing collaboration that maybe traditionally hasn't been there because people have been heads down in their own lane. Yeah, absolutely. I mean, I agree. I think that, you know, SDRs come into organizations and, you know, they're always looking to move up somewhere, right? And it's interesting, because if we built, I think when I first joined a very intentionally built a cop plan that they can kind of climb the rungs of the SDR world, and they can qualify to then go interview for account executive roles as they open. And a lot of them have done that. A lot of them are now great account executives for us. But just as things evolve and especially over the last eight months, um, there's definitely a little more of a push towards a subset of them saying, Hey, I want to move into leadership or I wanna move and I want to do this instead. And I think...

...that's great, right? Right. There's no reason that we can't build a bench for other teams outside of just the account executive team again, the majority you're gonna wanna go there, right? It's a stepping stone, and I understand all that. But you know, most of the leaders on the team now started as SDRs, though they were hired in his SDR, ones worked their way up, got promoted. You know, Dre was the first person that we went external for because we were looking for more of a director level person at that point, right? I started as an SDR back in the day it sales for, So I'm part of that crew to Yeah, no, I mean, I think so many of us, right? We have thio, You start there and that that allows you the foundation. Dre, you mentioned around creativity and that really, being the currency that you see today and especially is, you know, we're going into the new year. I'm curious if there's any, you know, notable moment that's sticking out in your mind around creativity or how the teams rally together that you want to share with our audience. Yeah, So I'm gonna have to do a product pitch here, but I have never in my entire career sent any type of direct mail or physical mail in any of the sequences or teams that I lead so theon pertinent to come over. Santos was really exciting to think about an alternate channel and honestly, in my last couple of months, this has been just so incredible to see the conversion and see how this alternate channel really connects with people, right? You know, whether it's doing research and seeing that somebody is a bulldog lover and sending them like a special outfit for their bulldog Or, you know, really finding those really interesting components of that which makes us who we are today are true authentic Selves. And those are the moments that are reps are really capitalizing on and then sending right we same or out of the inbox into the mailbox. And so I think, like, really understanding, like what really drives people toe work and understanding those capabilities and sticking mawr into? I saw that you're passionate about this. This is how you could use Endo. So in that type of value prop, then just particular personas is something that has been so interesting to me and that I have to say, just like being genuine, right. I think I come to kind of come from an old school train of thought, which was like, I don't know about too many emojis and emails or like memes, and I've really learned a lot of Sando. So about utilizing those in the right aspect to truly like being your true, authentic self, right? I think that utilizing those in a, you know in a certain capacity really shows your voice and 2020. I'm only going to spend time with people that I know we're gonna be worth worth by time. And they're going to deliver value to me, right? And so I think that being ableto have these kind of unique touch points as well as, like, really show like who you are and like, you know, one of our top reps Like when you reading these emails You're laughing like you are like I can feel like you're writing this. I could see you just like a hustler. Str and those people like I want to give you time. And so I think like what I've learned is like not only being personalized to, like, you know, hobbies or things that really are the important things of every of all of our lives, Not work rallying around that and then really just being your true authentic self or like, two things that have been like a game changer in the way that I've always thought about, like corporate prospecting or just like what an outbound function looks like. So just a little bit about Shindo. So there you could check us out window, so dot com e nothing less from from sales leaders to do a little name drop little called action e Love that. Go ahead, Joe. I'm sorry, just just to piggyback on what I just said, like what came to mind is like one like actual example of an SDR doing this and really hitting a home run. It's a rough Andre Steam. His name's David. We call him Beast Mode, and he was engaged with the prospect on LinkedIn and again, I'm paraphrasing the conversation, but the question was, well, like, what can I send it to the platform? And David's reply was anything. So the guy said, Okay, cool. Send me a Ferrari and I'll take a...

...meeting. David went on. Amazon found this remote control Ferrari, and this is before we were right before we went work from home, sent it to the office, and the prospect loved this thing. He was examining around the office. All the exact team was playing with it. Sure enough, like a day or two later, the guy replies saying How you know, awesome. That was a great outreach way to think out of the box. And before you know it, we've got an account executive on a call it, like four or five stakeholders. So, like empowering somebody like David to be super creative and, you know, leverage all the tools at his disposal and, you know, send the guy a Ferrari, you know, ended up being a really, really good meeting that we were able to book and secure and sent over the account executive team. Yeah, I think that one thing that isn't is not unique with your product is the fact that you condemn Oh, your capabilities within your outrage. And I think for a lot of us in, you know, the SAS world or in the sales and marketing world that is the case. There is a chance to showcase our product. And I think that you know, you guys have a a pretty cool value prop that authenticity and personalization and creativity those things that sometimes to your point, Dre older school sales might say no, don't lean so far into those. You're in an environment with an organization with a brand that the more of that, the better. And because it's it's demonstrating your product itself. And so I think that any of you listening out there thinking about what is it really the problem we're solving? How do we demonstrate that in a way that feels authentic, not forced? You know? Hey, this is our product. But demonstrate that in a way that feels relatable and an educational, too. I think that we are there. I have seen that customers give a lot more grace Right now. They're seeing their They're seeing the sellers as more human, too. And so that's a moment in time that capitalize on, Yeah, I mean, I think I think right now it's a pretty stressful world we all live in, and you could make someone laugh or brighten up their day just a little bit. It's gonna go a really long way completely I This has been a really, honestly fun conversation. I I You guys can't see the video, but I am loving how excited Dre gets what she's talking about, like her energy is palpable, and I think I mean that's an example in this virtual world like, how do you show up? How do you let that excitement come across the screen? And so as we all go into 2021 virtual selling. Yes, it's here for this moment in time, but I think that we're going to continue to see this long after whatever this pandemic impacts our business, just the flexibility of work, ability to reach different kinds of talent and so realizing and starting to build that muscle around. How do you personalize How are you creative both internally and externally? Because I heard that you will talk a lot about that internal team as well today. Yeah, I mean, I think that, you know, without the internal team, people like Drake and I don't exist. I think that it Z I've always said that. You know, there is nothing more important in my job than the individuals that are on my team, and this has really been an opportunity for me to kind of back that statement up. It's again pretty easy when you're in the office to just swim like someone's desk and how you doing to check in and all that. But in a world when you know people are struggling and having a tough time. And you know there's just genuine fear and uncertainty out there, like it's really an opportunity for managers to become great leaders and mentors and, you know, help bring people through, you know, really, really difficult time. I would imagine that when the dust settles, whatever that is, the people that have kind of seen this thing through with you, you will have an amazing bond with in a really, really sense of accomplishment. So, like, for me, that's kind of the light at the end of the tunnel. I don't know how long the tunnel is, but I'm committed to get. I'm committed to getting there coming...

...up better than we went in completely. And I as a former sales leader, having those goals in those milestones in mind, they help keep motivation even as a manager. So, to your point, I love the reframing of during this moment in time. How can I show up for my team in the best way? Becoming competitive about that almost with yourself, I think is is spot on. Um, thank you both for being guest on the show today. This was fun. So thank you for having us. Yes, absolutely. This is Joe Venuti and Dre Leiden, the director of sales and vice president of Inside Sales. That's window. So my name is Casey. Let Gordon I'm your host of the revenue collective podcast, and we'll see you next time we did it. Another episode down and one step closer. Teoh. A New year. A new content for the revenue Collective podcast. I'm excited. All right, we'll see you next time. In the meantime, go check out outreach. Our sponsor, the Revenue Collective podcast, is powered by outreach, the sales engagement platform for the modern sales work. I want to see what the number one sales engagement platform can do for your business. Head to www dot outreach dot io toe. Learn more. I'm Casey. Let Gordon and we'll see you next time.

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