The Pavilion Podcast
The Pavilion Podcast

Episode · 4 months ago

Ep 189: Random Acts of Content w/ Cassandra Jowett

ABOUT THIS EPISODE

Ep 189: Random Acts of Content w/ Cassandra Jowett

Part of the "Is This A Good Time?" series hosted by Brandon Barton.

Look. Hello everyone, and welcome back to the pavilion podcast. I am your host, Brandon Barton, and you are listening to is this good time? The show where I put a William members on the hot seat for fifteen minutes. We hear their incredible stories. New for twenty two, by the way. Shows are out every Thursday and if you hit subscribe, we you will miss hearing from our experts. Our guess today is Cassandra Jowett. She is a senior director of marketing a path factory, and we talked about random acts of content and love to that phrase. This episode of the Pavilion Podcast is powered by show pad, the open end platform that makes me to be buying and telling easier transform your team to have high impact and differentiated customer conversations in today's environment. Want to see a revenue enablement technology that provides every customer facing team with required skills, knowledge and content to have impactful conversation with your buyers. Head to www dot show petcom to learn more. All right, let's see this episode ninety two. Is this good time? All right, everyone, we are here with Cassandra Jowett. She is a senior director of marketing a path factory, currently digging her way out of the snow in Toronto. CASSANDRA's so great to have you on the podcast. Thank you so much for having me. Well, look, I'll meet Nope, ere the we want to jump right into the questions. Look, tell us a little bit about what you do at path factory. You've been there for four years. Bring us through kind of what you've done there and then bring us all the way back to the beginning of your career and in terms of you know, how you got to where you are today. Sure, so, I'm a bit of a I like to call myself a bit of a marketing Swiss army knife, because I've done a lot of different things throughout my career and including here at path factory. So I started out doing the content thing, being the director of content, and then, as business needs change, as as the team sort of grew, shifted whatever, I just sort of fell into trying other things, which often happens as I'm fast growing startups. If you sort of show an aptitude for being curious and trying to understand different marketing functions,...

...then you can definitely sort of poke your nose in and at different opportune times and just say like hey, what's going on here? Maybe I can help and you know, hopefully if you sort of showing that you can do a good job in one capacity, then they'll give you the opportunity to try other things. And certainly as a content marketer, I have always been very curious about sort of the connection to revenue and trying to get closer to revenue all the time. You know, I certainly believe in content from a brand perspective and thought leadership and all that kind of stuff, but certainly I feel much more comfortable the closer I am to actually generating sales pipeline and revenue at BDB companies with the content that I'm producing, and so I just sort of, you know, started to become more and more curious about that side of things and also about customer marketing. I worked at a company called influided for a couple of years and really sort of dove deep into customer marketing and advocacy and became passionate about that side of things as well and trying to understand the role that content can play in terms of onboarding your customers, helping them upsell, Cross cell, renew, adopt new product features, all that kind of stuff. So talk about that, because it's that you know, I don't think we bring that up to often on the pod, but, you know, marketing to existing customer base and in terms of, you know, probably improving net retention or just upsell like cross cell and all those different things. Say there for a second. What charter? What are some of the things that you've found are very successful in doing that? Or, like, how would you market to somebody as are on boarding? What's that? What's the play there? Well, I think, especially at BEDB companies, it's important to keep in mind that the people that you sold to may not actually be the people that are ultimately using your product every single day, actually logging into the software or whatever it is to get things done, and so sometimes you do have to re educate people or educate them in the first place because their new coming in. Sometimes, especially during the pandemic, like entire teams turnover and you have to start from scratch in terms of proving yourself and showing people how to use your software or services. So I really see it as an ongoing thing. Just because you sold a company an account once doesn't mean you're done selling them. And often you have different products and services that you may...

...want to add on to their package. Like you're trying to grow the revenue that you know that they're paying you, and you not from like a shady perspective, but that's just how business works and I think every CEO and marketing leader and Salesperson would agree that it is cheaper to grow your existing customers and to acquire new customers. But you know, I find the balances often a little bit off in the Revenue Organization, where there is a huge focus and lots of resources dedicated to attracting and converting new business and then very little dedicated to, you know, adopting, retaining growing you are existing business outside of say like CSUNS, who are really just trying to often keep the lights on and you might have an account manager who, like, swoops in at the eleventh hour. So I think marketing has a strong role to play there and there are also lots of signals that your customers can throw off that can sort of help you understand which customers might be closer to being ready to be up sold or cross old and when. And I think from an an account based marketing perspective in particular, it's really important to look at if you're selling into enterprise accounts, what it can what can the growth be of that entire account versus just, you know, the one division that you have. And so understanding how those people are engaging with with your marketing is so critical. And you know, trying to get them to engage more is and if they're able to do that, that's usually a sign that they're a happier, more engage customer who is going to grow, versus people who, you know, very rarely engage with anything. And you can think of it. You know, you might look at Pendo to try to grow what they're doing in your product, right, but you also want to grow the education that they have around not just your product but your business. You're always trying to improve your brand perception among your customers so that they do become advocates. So marketing has a really important role to play there. For Sure, interesting, interesting, and and so, you know, apart from people that people probably doing like, you know, a standard like newsletter, right, like writer, some other things. I mean, is this is this like account based marketing where you're actually doing dinners and stuff on the enterprise level, or is it really like...

...you know, is it actually like having ads directed at your car and customers? Would give me, give me a sense of what you what you think is effective? Yeah, I think all of those things can definitely be effective. It just depends on where you want to focus, what what the priorities are for your business, how much budget you can have all those sorts of things. So, you know, I think at a smaller budget level, doing some one too many type of webinars or programs or content, you know, is probably the place to start. And you know, I think a lot of companies aren't even doing the baseline of Hey, we have a new product, not just that we're we've announced it, but we want to bring you into the fold and we want to give you early access and we want to make you feel special because you are customers and tell you about it before anyone else. So those sorts of like sneak peaks or early looks, that where everything is going, can be really important. You know, your your software, your services probably has key US cases that you're trying to get your customers to adopt more of. So can you educate them again through Webinars, events, content, whatever it is, you know, to get them to adopt more use cases so that their business is a lot stickier with you and they sort of understand the value. You're not just a one trick pony. I know like here at path factory we have a minimum of five use cases and that's US keeping it really tight because you can do so much more with it. But you know, if so many customers are just using one and they change their focus and that might mean that they're at a higher risk to turn for example. So if you can get them doing like three, four use cases, then that's that's ideal. So things like that. And then I think partnering with the Sales Team and the see SEM team for sure. On you know, who were those really high potential accounts who could grow to, you know, x millions of dollars over the next year or two? And how do you get introduced to more folks within that organization? Usually they're the large ender prize companies where you might have a division or two and you might have a couple internal advocates. So are they willing to sort of go to bat for you and and make introductions for you, gather people for events, if that's you know, when that's possible again, travel all that that sort of thing, but that's that's certainly, you know, it's more of a sales led effort than marketing. It's more just like marketing, supporting and...

...providing the resources and all that kind of stuff, versus actually like creating the content, educating, educating customers. and Go back for secondtils. Just give us the whole spiel on path factory. Sure, so, path factories and intelligent content platform for bb marketers and sales people. The idea is really that we all have to give our customers and prospects tons of content to get them to convert, to get them to become customers, to get them to adopt, upsell, that sort of stuff. And you know, there's a lot of data locked within that content. There's a lot of data blocked within the engagement that that happens between content and the visitors. So we basically use AI to suck in all that data and turn it into usable, usable insights for marketers and salespeople so they can sort of know which accounts are the most engage, which people are the most engaged and why, what topics are they interested in, what content assets? When you can do all kinds of cool stuff with that data around, you know, your getting automation platform where your sales cadences and all that kind of stuff. Love it, love it sounds. Sounds like, you know, the perfect tool for somebody like yourself. It is. I mean, the reason I joined this company five years ago is because I really enjoyed and I thought I enjoyed the product and it was much simpler backs end. Of course, it's grown a lot in the last five years, but I saw it demoed at a trade show and I thought it really checked a lot of the boxes that I, as a marketer, had been trying to accomplish a various companies. And you know, I think the biggest thing is you create all this content, but it's really difficult to sort of weave together the actual journey that you need to take someone on. It can sort of start to feel like random acts of content and you're not sure if people are really, you know, on the right path to actually buying something. It's, you know, they're filling out of forms, downloading e book and they're joining a Webinar and they're reading a blog post, but like, is it really relevant to them or they getting the information they need when they're actually interested in looking at it? I don't know. And so I had done all kinds of, you know, hacky things with bird press, trying to, you know, create sort of one size fits all journeys for...

...people. But you know that is pretty limited and it doesn't respond to different, different needs, different audiences. And so, you know, the idea that there might be software that could help me with that because it's, you know, much smarter than any single marketer could ever be. That that was really exciting idea. Very cool. Well, luck. We always talk about luck and hard work. Both get you know, both getting you to where you are today. Give us an example of either in your in your career that have gotten you kind of to this step? Sure, so on the hard work side, and you know, I always have a hard time talking about a sexcep. Sure everyone works hard and there's there's a lot of that going around, but I think for me I try to jump in and try to solve, solve problems that maybe are not within my job description. I've always worked at startups and so just finding opportunities to say hey, what's going on over there, maybe we can come up with a solution or something like that, or to take a problem that no one's ever solved before and try to figure it out within my area of expertise. I really think that content in particular has has the potential to solve all kinds of problems across the business. You just have to get creative and try things and see if they work. So certainly I think that kind of attitude, which I don't know if that counts is hard work or not, but that kind of attitude can definitely help and, you know, has given me all kinds of opportunities to try things that I probably never would have done if someone, you know, had just said you have to stay within your job description at a huge county or something like that. So there's that side of things. On the luck side, I've been very fortunate to have some really great managers and mentors who have given me some of those opportunities, who have trusted me to try things that I've never done before and maybe no one at the company has ever done before. So, you know, whether it's writing a keynote for a CEO when I've never delivered a keynote myself that ever, and then, you know, being successful at it. So doing it over and over again and just making that part of my repertoire to, you know, trying to leave things like demand Jen when I've never held, you know, a demand Jen or marketing operations position. But you know, I feel like I'm capable of understanding what's going on there and and managing the people who were doing that work just by asking a lot of questions and being curious about what's happening in that function.

So things like that have really helped me and I think that that kind of luck of finding the right people to work with who will give you the space to try those things is really important. Yeah, you know it's it's often you obviously pick a job, but they always say you pick a boss and it's hard to get to know that person in the hour that you're answering questions to them. You know, probably more toy, but at the same time, you know it's a little bit better in a situation like yours, where you've been in a company for a few years and have been able to navigate your way to the right position. Sounds super cool. All right, this next one's got to be easy for you. Give us. Give us a marketing tactic that people should use that they're not using today. Right, I always struggle with this one so much because I hate their marketing tactics just really nilly. But one thing that, you know, I've really come around to hear at path factory and that I certainly believe in just as a person, is on gating as much content as possible. And I know that a lot of marketers bristle at this idea because it's sort of how they're measured. And like maybe the problem isn't that you know you're not able to be measured. Just find a different way to be measured and provide that better experience for people who are actually going to consume things. And even if you can just like reduce the number of forms, that that helps a lot. I've see a lot of companies still, even though I'm definitely in their database, I'm definitely cookied, I have to fill out a form every single time I land on a piece of content and then I have to go to my email to find it. Like that's just a terrible experience. So any way that you can reduce that friction for people, I think is super, super important, and you'll see immediately if you are setting things up to be measured, whether it's, you know, through something like path factory or through just like requested demo request, for example. Or take a demo request and which might be, you know, not a perfect measurement, but you should see that increase over time because you're exposing more people to your content and your ideas. I really don't understand those sort of ongoing desire to hold content hostage behind forms as much as possible, because that's just the best way for marketers to measure things. It's just totally backward. So for your content on gated as much as possible.

Rob It, rob it all right. Well, any this is more of the the quick fire around. Any keep position you're hiring for? Yes, I'm hiring for two content marketing roles right now. One is more of senior strategic sort of long form content role where they'll be working with our data team on reports and things like that and maybe some some pr work, and then a slightly more junior role that's more focused on like short form content, social media videos and all that, getting a bit creative and trying to find ways to take those big media ideas that were producing as a team and breaking it up into more digestible formats for, you know, all kinds of different channels that can be used by, you know, our content team, or demands on team, our customer marketing team, to try to sort of like tease teas what path factories all about and help people understand in in shorter segments. So both of those are up right now. We're interviewing but we haven't we haven't made any hires yet. So cool. Maybe maybe we'll find some people in the audience right give some shoutouts. Anybody who you want to shut out, who you loved their content, you appreciate what they're up to. Yeah, so Jillian would is one person I would say. She's been posting on Linkedin for the last little while all about content marketing and I think content marketers are generally not very self promotional and so they tend to be very quiet and don't actually say what they think. But Jill is getting out there and giving some really great content marketing tips based on her experience working for various ass companies. She was on my team at influid him and it's just a super smart content marketer and she has lots of great ideas and also is very direct sarcastic, so you might laugh along with her. And then one other person is my coworker MC, who goes by Marie clarissy. Go on linked in and she is just constantly sharing all kinds of great insights. She just won employee of the quarter for this and some other great work, so I think she's a person to follow if you want to sort of stay up to day on marketing trends as well. All right, cool, love it. All right. And last but not least, most important to me, you can give me anything. It doesn't need to be in Toronto. Would love to...

...understand. Give me it like a re restaurant recommendation. Yeah, this one is so hard because I haven't eaten out a restaurant in so long. I'm six months pregnant. I've been trying to avoid like endoor timing and that's it's incredible. Yeah, so it's been quite a while, but I still think about a meal I actually had in DC and I'm I'm going to struggle to remember the name of the hotel, but we were looking at a hotel for a conference and the meal was incredible. There was like like a fried, like crazy looking fish and it was just amazing. But I'm totally laying on the name right now. So I hope one day I can travel to you us again and eat there, but it's it's certainly been a while since I've been in order of a restaurant've been eating a lot of like truck stop hamburgers and that kind of stuff over the summer when it's actually nice weather outside. So yeah, when I'm looking forward to what I'm not pregnant and I can be a little bit more risky about things, I love it. Well, the that's just such incredible news to thrown at the end. While, Cassandra, so great to have you on. Really looking forward to keep an in touch and hopefully you know both the covid thing and the snow thing, and soon in Toronto so you can be free. Thanks. Yeah, everything ends eventually, it just takes a while, some time, so we'll see what happens. All right, thanks so much. Thanks for having me. All right, that's our show. Thank you so much for listening. If you love the PODCAST, please rate and reviews five stars and Apple podcast or spotify APP send it to some friends. Do the stuff. This pavilion podcast is powered by show pad for opportunity preparation or opportunity execution. Show pads everything your team needs add value, provide insights and engage with your customers. Want to learn more about Chowpad? Head to www dot chowpatcom for a personal assessment of your enablement journey. I tell much fun today. I hope you did too. Now get out their crushing numbers.

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