The Pavilion Podcast
The Pavilion Podcast

Episode · 1 month ago

Ep 150: Outsourcing SDRs w/ Catarina Hoch

ABOUT THIS EPISODE

Ep 150: Outsourcing SDRs w/ Catarina Hoch 

Part of the "Is This A Good Time?" series hosted by Brandon Barton.

Hello everyone and welcome back to thepavilion podcast. I'm your host. Brandon martin you're listening to Isthis a good time to show where I put Pavilion members on the hot seat talkfor 15 minutes. It's really fun, shows her out Tuesdays and thursday. So hitsubscribe. Don't miss any of our experts. Today we are talking toKatarina poke. She is the VP of global marketing and operatic outsourced SDRcompany and we dive into just that should people use Sdo outsourced SDR.When does it work? All that other good stuff. A lot of fun this month sponsoris Sindiso Sindhu. So the leading sending platform is the most effectiveway for revenue generating teams to stand out with new ways to engage atstrategic points throughout the customer. Great. Like connectingdigital and physical strategies. Companies can engage, acquire andretain customers easier than ever before. All right, let's do this. Thisis episode 71. Is this a good time? All right, everyone's so excited for ourguest today. We have Katarina hope she's a VP of global Mark Marketing andoperatic based in London. Really interesting company that doesoutsourced SDR. So carrying a so great to have you on the program. Thank youfor having me excited to be wonderful. Well look, we all meet no filler. Wejump right in. So tell us about the role that you're in and what thecompany does. And then a little bit about your background and how you gotto where you are today? Sure. So I'm the VP marketing and Operatic since weare a global outsourcers. Tr company, we've got offices in London and inDallas covering north America and the media And we have to be suspendersgenerate purple and revenue through our 150 str so we've got quite a big teamand I've been in the role for about five years now. I actually joined thecompany as an str And made my way up to...

...where I am now. So yeah, 19 times.That's incredible. So how long were you in str I did it for six months only andI actually joined in the working within the german market. So as you can hear,I've got a very german accent and I'm half german, so when I, but I joinedthe project, I was covering the german market and then after six months theyopened a role for a global marketing manager, which I applied for because mybackground has always been in marketing and I got the job and then here I amnow, wow. And what were you doing beforehand? Like give us a little bitof your, you know, your path to getting too operatic. Yeah, sure. So I kind oflanded in the nasty, I roll a bit by accident because I used to live inbrazil before. So I, I was born and raised in brazil some half Brazilianhalf german and when I moved to the UK I didn't speak english. So I had tolook for a job where I could speak german or Portuguese, which were thelanguages that I was familiar with, um, and that's how I landed operatic seasonstr because my, my background has always been in marketing. So I've gotmy degree in pr and I've worked 10 years and like agency side, digitalagency, advertisement agency, I was running a team within a sorry, fashionmagazine in brazil as well. So it was quite different to what I was doing atoperatic. So it was quite an interesting way to get into the bit ofattack industry for sure. Well, I mean it sounds like you took a stepbackwards to be an SDR right? Like, I mean that, that, that, you know,somewhat of a larger step back to step forward operatic snow, that you had nointerest in getting involved in marketing when you started there. Andkind of, they kind of new, hey, we'll start this person at the bottom, butthey might be a quick riser. I don't think they, they kind of knew that fromthe beginning because when I started, I had, you know, they could send my CVthat I had a lot of experience and...

...sales and marketing roles. But whatreally made me get a job was because I was a native german speaker, which wassuper important for that role And after a while, I think, I guess I wasprobably over qualified for the role, but because it was a big move from onecountry to the other, I knew I was, you know, I needed to take a bit of a stepback. But when the opportunity came up with the marketing role, I was like,wow that there would be a great opportunity for me to get back intomarketing, which is what I really love doing at the time. There still was abit of a language barrier. So it took me a while to actually improve myenglish. I'm still trying to improve it by the way, after five years. I butyeah, no, it was, it was quite special because I didn't actually expect it tobe so quick for me to be back into a marketing role, which was what I reallylove doing. And I think it was just me being at the right place at the righttime and the company is seeing that I could help them, you know, with, withmy whole experience in marketing. So it was like, look, I, I'm going to be theone to say just so you know, you speak three languages. All very, all verydifferent origin languages, right? Like, so, um, that's incredible. And I speaka grand total of one and I'm sure many people listening speak a grand total ofone. So I'm always impressed when people learn the language, you know,past their twenties, let's say, right? Like I didn't even have the capacityyoung when I was younger to really learn what I don't know, maybe one dayI'll be doing, go and do it. But hey, super cool. All right, here's the partbefore we get into more questions. I want you to make the pitch to theaudience why using outsourced SDR, like when you should accompany usedoutsourced SDR, it's for everybody and why is it great? Not necessarily withoperatic, but I'm just, I'm sure you take that perspective, but I think it'sa controversial subject. Right? So give...

...us the pitch, give us the real, youknow, elevator pitch on why somebody should try it. Yeah, So I guess thereis a bit of misconception about In the industry, about using our sourceagencies and I think there is always companies that will be a good fit forthat. And companies that just want, right to be honest, we have about 70%of our customers, they have internal str teams and they use us alongsidetheir internal team. And the reason why they would typically use us one is theymay have an incredible team that deals with inbound leads, but they reallystruggle with outbound. So that's when they would use this for more of anoutbound approach. Sometimes they have a very good outbound team and theystruggle with inbound, so they get us to, to, to the inbound piece. Sometimesit comes down to language capability. So let's say there is a company that isexpanding into the U. S. And they have, you know, great english speakers but Ineed to get into France Germany italy spain and so on. And then often theydon't really need a full time resource on that because they just don't have abig enough demand to cover a region with a full time resource so they canhire half german and half a french, for example with operatic and and have thatall managed within the same place. Right. And then sometimes companieswill come to us because they just I don't want to have the headache ofmanaging an str team or they just don't have the capacity to do that. Soespecially start ups when they are getting started and they sometimesdon't have an office or don't just don't have the structure to deal withthe SDR teams so they will outsource the whole function. And what oftenhappens is they realize actually as the company grows, it makes sense for us tokeep it outsource because it's just working. Right? So we've got a companythat has been our client for about 6.5 years now and start with the part timeresource and we have seven wraps on the...

...campaign now because we were just theywere growing and we were growing alongside them, right? And they justnever decided to take it in house. So is there caught, I mean, would youargue there's cost efficiency to hire somebody from the outside versusinternally, I'm saying almost specifically on a roll to roll basis, Iknow that there's efficiency because you're managing them and like there'scost to managing and cost of benefits and so forth. But in general, can yourcompany take somebody who's, let's say less trained, less educated perhaps andtherefore may be cheaper and turn them into a better SDR than most others canwrite like or most companies playing themselves. Is that kind of the pitch?Yeah. Well I guess, and we actually did an interesting podcast with MarkBertuzzi about that from the bridge group and what you're saying is likewhen you're on str and you're drawn into an environment where you have likepre sales engineers and then the sales people and marketing people and you'relike the only SD out there, you don't really have someone to kind of shareyour struggles with or like, you know, your frustrations and stuff. We have100 and 50 people working on the same challenges and day in day out goingthrough the same things and you know, there is a lot of synergy that goes onand that's why um it's quite a great environment for the S. T. A. T. And Ithink it also comes down to what you said about as nurturing talent andmaking sure that we can give them all the tools and the methodology and thetraining to make them successful. So we have some cool stories like one of ourreps, he's he used to be an opera singer and obviously with Covid, hecouldn't carry on in his job and now he's one of our top performing rampsbecause you know, we managed to hire him, train him, he goes through theoperatic academy that we call, which is our training on onboarding structure.Um and he's just doing really, really well, so it's about nurturing retainingtalent and kind of finding the people...

...with the right skill sets to make themsuccessful. Love it, love it. Well, look, I'm so interested in this becauseit's, it's an interesting way to scale. I've spent a lot of my time and seed alike, you know, the early stage companies, so, but look, I want to jumpto some other questions here, of course, we always talk about luck is being acomponent, getting where you are. Do you have any stories to be the luck orlike extreme, hard work that have helped propel your career forward? Ithink my whole career in the U. K was a bit of kind of the mixture of luck andhard work. I don't, I don't think there is such a thing as like, I think, Ithink luck is a consequence of hard work and if you think about it is a bitof a compound effect, it's like you do a lot of things right in life for youto see the results out of that. So it's not something that you, you just do onething, right? And then you get the reward for it, you have to doconstantly lots of things right to then see the results on it. There is a bookcalled the slide and which kind of talks about that little bit, which isquite interesting. So shouted there for the, for the audience. But yeah, withwith my career in the U. K, I think it was, it was a great example of hardwork and luck because I started a job that I really didn't really knowexactly what it was that I had to do is nice. Yeah, but I had to experience, Ihad the skills I got through the trading and I smashed it and then Ilanded into a job which was what I actually really wanted to do, which ismarketing and then here I am now, it's like somebody who wouldn't, some peoplewould call that circumstance, you know, there was, there's a dash of luck inthere. So look, I I uh I appreciate the whole uh it's a result of hard work,but there are always little moments of serendipity that propel you forward andthank goodness you know, for for you at operatic that the opportunities becameavailable in the marketing department of thing that you love and you know, sogood. Well look, being that you are such an expert in, in SDR work andmarketing sales tactics. Give us a...

...tactic that's like a really practicalthing that somebody can kind of throw into what they do today. I wonder likewhat's the best practice that you can share? You know, I don't think there islike a silver bullet in marketing because I'm always a big advocate oflike playing the long game, right? I mean but I mean you have to think longthe long game, but you have to also make an impact in the short short term,right? Because and bring that to my reality when and when I joined thepolitics marketing team, we weren't actually a team, it was only myself andwe didn't have any marketing in place before. So I had to build everythingfrom from the ground and I needed to make sure that in a company that ispredominantly sales driven that they could see valiant marketing. So if Ijust kept kind of working, you know, the long game, I probably wouldn't havemy job or wouldn't grow within my career, so it's kind of finding theright balance between doing the long term right and also thinking about howyou can prove value on the short term. So just bring it back to my situationat the beginning, we had a really low budget and I just needed to kind of beable to prove prove myself. So typically what I would do as a lowbudget, small startup kind of thing um email campaigns or get your str teamdoing a very tailored outreach, you know, So it's kind of thinking abouthow how do you balance the brand building and the long term strategywith, with how you can impact things on the short term. Yeah, I mean, look,this is this is the delicate balance of marketing is is we need to hit goalstoday, but you also need to hit your goals for the bigger and much biggergrowth goals for next year and everything like that. So I love it. Umwell look, what are, do you have any positions you're hiring for? Uh, youknow now? Yeah, well, so we are always hiring for SDR obviously being an SDRcompany, we always need talented SDR so...

...we are hiring for our office in Dallasas well as in London, we are also having opportunities remotely as longas they are based in one of those, that was one of the things that Covid toldus. You don't need everybody in the office to to get people working well.But yeah, scr roll, always, always hiring, we are growing like crazy. Sowe need more christians love it. Love it. And give some shout out to anybodyany quick names you want to mention is people you appreciate kind of whatcontent they're putting out or people that you met that have inspired you andso forth. Yeah, I mean there's lots of people I I admire and that inspire mebut I would probably mention a few channels that I kind of, that's where Iget my inspiration from. So pavilion is one, you know, I love all the, I thinkit's great for benchmarking and I love the lunch relax and where you just, youknow speak to people that you wouldn't probably have come across before fordifferent reasons and like all the slack channels, there is a lot you canlearn on there, Lincoln is a great platform as well. You know, if youfollow the right people, there is a lot of free content out there and get tipsand tactical things that you can learn and there is the, our podcast as well.So we have a podcast called me to be revenue acceleration. It's hosted byour Ceo and we've got some great guests on there. We actually had some Jacobsthere. Yeah, it's me on the platform. I like good andlast but not least especially given how diverse your background is. I wouldlove to know, give me a great spot to go. It could be in London could be inbrazil, give us a restaurant that we can go seek out. Right. I was going tosay my favorite place to eat is my mom's house. Like she, she cooks anamazing german food but I don't think that's going to be open for the world.So uh um no, but well there is a place...

I really like in London which is calledAqua Kyoto is a, is an asian restaurant. They've got a, it's like a, a nicerooftop terrace where you can see London and they've got an amazing food.So a Kyoto love it. We'll check it out. I mean, it's so great to have you on uh,you know, loved hearing about kind of this whole outsourced SDR world and I'mlooking forward to staying in touch. Cool. Thank you Brandon. It was apleasure. All right, that's our show. Thank you so much for listening. If youlove the show, please rate and review in apple podcast, Spotify, send it tofriends. Make sure to hit the subscribe button. We love that a reminder. Thisepisode was brought to you by Sandoz. So they deliver modern direct mail,personalized gifts and other physical impressions that make your outreachmore personal. Cool. I had fun. This is great. Such an interesting conversation.Hope you do too. Now go crush your numbers. Say something. Mhm.

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